What would you do? I am struggling with an issue – shortly before my husband passed I was called in by management and informed that a worker had reported that another worker had taken videos of my husband - this is, of course, not allowed, and a total invasion of privacy. My husband was a very private person, but at the end, was unable to object to anything – let alone someone taking a video of him when he was most vulnerable. I was with him most of the time, but not all the time, and to think that someone could be so callous and unfeeling as to video him when he was dying and unable to respond or object sickens me. My husband passed on July 8th, and I have been trying to get to the bottom of this since then. It has been put off and put off, and finally I cannot take it anymore. The City became involved, and also the union, and I am having a very stressful time getting at the truth. My husband was, in truth, one of the most gentle, compassionate people, and to think that someone would take advantage of him in his most vulnerable moments just sickens me. I don’t want a lawsuit – just answers as to who reported it, the person who supposedly took the videos, why (it is prohibited)… I need answers – I miss my husband SO much, but on top of this, all of this is so hard to handle. I know there are privacy issues, as was pointed out to me, but what our OUR privacy – what about my husband’s privacy?
I told staff that I wanted answers to: who reported; who was accused; when this would be resolved, and I wanted to know all of these details or I would go to the Ministry of Health or the newspapers. What bothers me most is that I know that 98% of the staff are hard-working and caring – I want to make sure that whoever did this (PROVE TO ME THAT THEY DIDN’T, or why was it reported), is fired so they can’t victimize other helpless residents . Please let me know what you would do. On top of losing him, I am struggling to deal with this. What would you do?
Sorry you are having to even deal with this. I agree, they should never have video taped him. I wonder what their purpose for doing it?
My first thought would be to just let it go and go on with the grieving and healing process. But reality is it would probably eat at you hindering the healing process, so go with your gut on this. Plus, it may well protect someone else from having this happen to them. And, getting to the bottom of this may be what you need to start the healing process.
Oh marg, I am so sorry. This is a violation of so many moral and ethical principles as well as so many laws.
What I would do is to find someone to help you handle this matter. I don't see how someone who is so recently bereaved, can maintain a professional distance from this (although you seem to be doing pretty well!) If you are able to hire a lawyer, that person could handle the negotiations for you. It need not involve a lawsuit. I would suggest that you have initial meetings with some lawyers to see how they would propose handling this sensitive matter and how much it would cost. (I know you are in Canada but if you were in my state in the U.S., you could recover your attorneys' fees under our state consumer protection law.)
Another suggestion is to call the Ministry of Health yourself and ask which department or division handles complaints (against nursing homes. The person who did this should be fired and the facility should be required to chang its procedures.
Right now, I'm worried about destruction of evidence (the video).
I'm so sorry first for your loss and secondly that you are going through this. I live in Ontario Canada and I would not hesitate to contact the ministry of Health and put in a request for an inquiry. Try to call C.C.A.C and get the correct number and ask for the team to go in and investigate and give you the answers you need. This is unacceptable behaviour and maybe you will protect someone else from this horror. The person who has done this is cruel and should be fired.
After reading your troubling story, I started thinking about why anyone would want to take videos of someone with dementia and the thought occurred to me that I've seen similar videos in Alzheimers awareness documentaries. Could it possibly be that whoever took the video was trying to promote Alzheimers awareness with the best of intentions?
I agree that it was certainly a mistake to do it without your approval but if it happened to be done with honest intentions then maybe it could be considered an honest mistake. And maybe your husband would want you to forgive.
I hope, Margret......that you can find the circumstances behind this and act accordingly.
Perhaps because it is September 11 my feelings of agitation are running strong today. But, since you asked what we would do, I would follow the course suggested by myrtle. I am not Canadian so don't have the valuable posted insights of the process there. Concerning the video itself, did one worker actually witness the filming of the video and/or view it? Was it viewed by others?
Not necessarily a lawsuit if you don't want that- but legal counsel because there are damages involved. marg78* I am so sorry you and your husband have been violated in this manner.
Hi all, With your support and encouragement I spoke with my lawyer today (she is handling matters still connected with my husband’s passing).
Myrtle, your advice was perfect – my lawyer felt I was being sluffed off, particularly in such a sensitive and personal matter, and got on the phone to find the proper person at the Ministry to speak with (thanks, Jazzy). She then spoke with them and then handed me the phone and I filed right then for an investigation, and was told that they would get back to me by next Thursday. (I think it helped that my lawyer phoned.) They sounded like they really cared. Now I wait and see what happens. My lawyer wants an update, and will step in if necessary. So, I feel much better for having taken the action.
I still feel bad that the Home will have to be involved, because there are so many kind, caring people there (i.e. the person who reported it), but I tried and tried to get answers that were not forthcoming. Thanks to all who responded. George, I wish everybody was like you – always expecting the best of people – I mostly always do, too, but in this case, why would I have been advised by management that a video had been taken, as it was forbidden. God bless your kind, innocent heart!
Charlotte, Jazzy, Elizabeth, Abby and all, thank you! I will let you know what happens. Margaret
I would want to know what the video was about and how long ago was it taken and then proceed.
Was there a gathering that he was at that the video had other residents in it? Or just him himself. How long ago was it taken and was he aware and participating.
I know I take pictures of myself and my clients doing things. There is no malice intended just memories of the event we share. Also we have a client that is terminal that we have taken our picture with just so we can have the memory of her when she passes because we really care about the people we support. She is still aware and up and walking around if she was bedridden and out of it then not.
I can't remember where you live (British Columbia?) and what you do for a living, Amber. But in the States, for health care workers to take photos of, or be in photos with clients is a big no-no. We would have had to get special permission from higher levels, and the clients would have had to sign special releases that it was OK.
Amber, I can’t get that info, and that is what is SO frustrating. I was with him almost all day until his bedtime, every day especially towards the end, and if there was entertainment or a group I would have been with him. At that time I did not take him to group things because he was not aware of what was going on. I tend to think it is a more personal video, not with good intentions, either toileting or when he was noisy. Because I was coming early every day, the PSWs toileted and dressed him, then turned on his music, and mostly always closed his door over until I got there because they knew I was coming and because he was noisy. Like George, I never suspect people until it has been proven that they can’t be trusted. This time I was notified by management that a staff reported another staff taking a video. Even though he was noisy, he was a gentle man, and most of the staff treated him with care and courtesy, and lots of times with hugs. I think that the person who reported this saw something and felt he was being disrespected. I hope I am proven wrong, but if not, I will most definitely pursue this.
Elizabeth, I know it is prohibited to take photos or videos of residents unless there is permission from the family.
Elizabeth, (or anyone who would like to comment) don't mean to put you on the spot here, but, if you could not get answers in a timely fashion (over 2 months now), what would you do? I am trying to see this from all sides. Margaret
P.S. George - what I said above was with the greatest respect. From reading your postings it is obvious that you are a wonderful man. Many times I have believed unquestioningly and found that I was so wrong. Please accept my apologies if this came out the wrong way. It is obvious how much your loved your Helen. Margaret
Marg78, I would do exactly what Myrtle and Jazzy have suggested, and let the lawyer do the investigating. I also would have your attorney talk with the facility and suggest that the staff should have an inservice or continuing education on issues related to photography, videos, audiotaping, etc. of patients. They need to understand the legal issues involved, as well as the ethical ones, to prevent this kind of impropriety happening again. Every staff member in the place probably has a cell phone with a camera...and they need to be reminded of the importance of respecting patient confidentiality, privacy, dignity, etc. They are breaking the law if they are using those cell phone cameras inappropriately, and they're liable to lose their jobs as well as go to jail.
The aides are not always the brightest bulbs in the chandelier, and in this day and age where everything is uploaded in two minutes to Instagram, SnapChat, or whatever...everything is cell phones and tablets...everything is online whether appropriate or not...they probably could use a big educational piece and reality check...whether they were the one who video'd your husband or not. There is no excuse. It is illegal. Period, end of discussion. They could go to jail. (Yes, I know I said that twice. It's important.)
And George, I respect you totally, but I do think you are being overly nice about this. Whether the person meant well, or at least had no particular bad motives...that person was violating patient confidentiality and breaking the law. There is no excuse, and whether or not they're a good person at heart is irrelevant. And if they were filming or photographing for some kind of educational purpose, like a documentary on Alzheimers or some such thing...they could not have legally done that without Marg78 signing off in writing that she would allow it.
Marg78, if the facility is stonewalling, you and the attorney need to keep pushing and going to higher levels. This may unfortunately turn out to be one of those cases where the party with the most money wins...the party that can keep paying to drag it out until the other party gives up. But I think at the very least the attorney should insist on a re-training of all the staff on this issue.
I guess I'm at a loss as to why management called you in and told you about this event in the first place. After they told you, what did they say - did they say they were investigating further, or what. It just doesn't make any sense to me that they would inform you about it, and then do nothing. I'll be interested in hearing the outcome. Like others above, I'd let your lawyer contact them and see what happens. It's just very sad that you have this torment added to your grief.
Elizabeth, I SO appreciate your comments. We are on the same wavelength when it comes to patient privacy. I have to really think this over - on the one hand I was wondering if I should approach the Administrator herself, and lay this out, suggesting (your suggestion) that there be some education regarding patient privacy. My feeling was that she (the Administrator) was trying to do a good job. On the other hand, perhaps if I approached her it might be the wrong time, considering the circumstances and my complaint. I should probably ask my lawyer about that. On the other hand, the Ministry may hold the answer, as it is their duty to investigate and get the facts.
Thank you again. I helps to get other opinions and ideas. I don't want to have tunnel vision.
I will definitely mention the retraining to my lawyer and perhaps the Ministry.
I really enjoy following how you are doing - I'm sure many of us have similar problems, but I certainly cannot express them as clearly or easily - but then, you are a writer! Best wishes and thanks, Margaret
When they called me in, they said it was their duty to advise me of the complaint. Since then I have been trying to get information, but there is always some problem ... they need to further interview, they need to do further investigation, etc. etc. I always have to call them, and I am always put off. Every time I phone (and I have given them a chance - the last time - end of August - they said they would have information early in September. When I called about September 8th they said they were still investigating ... that I may never get the answers to my questions because of confidentiality etc. It just keeps making things worse, and makes me more suspicious. Thanks for your input. My concern is also for patients who do not have family to defend them.
marg78, Everyone who has commented on your situation has made excellent points and suggestions. The only reason there is disagreement about what to do is because people are assuming different things about what happened and why. Without this information, no one can make an informed decision about what should be done about it. It's a two-part process. First, you need to find out exactly how you have been wronged - how serious was it, how long did it go on, what was the motive? Then you need to think about the remedy.
Retraining is something that is often included as part of the remedy in settlements of cases that involve employment discrimination on the basis on race, sex, or ethnic group. But you need to find out exactly what happened and why before you can think about whether retraining is an appropriate remedy. So follow the course you have begun with your lawyer and the Ministry of Health. Give the process a chance. If it doesn't work, you can get take stronger action later.
Hang in there! We are all hoping you get the answers you need.
Hi Myrtle, I agree that it is difficult to know what happened and why. I know only that my husband was a gentleman, even to the end, and others commented (as I always felt), that although shy, there was something about him that made you know he was a class act. I don’t want to make matters worse, and that is why I have been trying to get the information I need. I don’t want to think that someone would be so cruel as to take advantage of him. But, I want to be sure of that. The last thing I want would be a lawsuit – I believe that this was probably during the end of his life when he was totally unable to voice his objection (he couldn’t talk) or to tell me. He could do nothing on his own – couldn’t move, couldn’t speak, etc. , and was totalling incontinent, etc. And I believe it happened probably only once – at least I hope so! If the video was taken, I do not believe the motive was a good one – probably to ridicule someone who was incapable to defending themselves – and that torments me every day. I tried always to protect him. What I am trying to do is find out exactly if it happened, what happened, (otherwise why would it be reported), and who did it. I would certainly like to thank the kind soul who reported it. Because I was there so much I think I know who the ‘good guys’ were, and who might possibly be suspect. I will continue on with my lawyer and the Ministry, and give the process a chance. Please know that your comments/advice are very much appreciated. I will let you know what happens. Margaret
I've been following this & the one thing I can't figure out is why in the world would anyone want to videotape (I guess that's the old word!) someone who was ill, unable to speak or do for himself? What possible reason could there be? It will be interesting to know if & when marg78 gets that information.
To me it sounds almost cruel, but then again, I don't know the circumstances.....
I have been told that the report will be completed within the next two days, and then will have a meeting to find out exactly what happened. Can't say any more right now, but I have to make a note of questions that need answers. Thanks everyone for your input.
The two days have passed, and I did not get my answer. Very disappointed. I did get a call from the Administrator (I do respect her and the job she is trying to do), and then a phone call from her boss, wanting to have a meeting and talk about it. On thinking this over, I felt they would not be telling me anything other than what I found out myself through other channels, so I said I wanted to know what the goal of the meeting was, who would be attending, was I going to get the information I wanted, or was it going to be the same story I had heard from others (that they couldn’t tell me anything), etc. That was 2 days ago, and I’ve heard nothing further. I had set a deadline of September 28th (Monday), and mentioned a couple of options I was considering. I have to decide what action to take – I believe in sticking to my word. So, there it stands. Thanks very much to all who have commented and given their advice. I truly appreciate it. We’ll see what happens next.
marge78, The silence sounds as if they do not have any final answers for you. Glad you are sticking to your word so you will have tried your best to make sure this does not happen to someone else. Makes me think you are a very caring lady. Good luck.
An update I was promised a report within two days at the latest. After almost 3 months, I told them my deadline. After the two days passed I sent an email, and said that my last deadline was up. A few hours later I received a phone call from the boss of the Administrator who wanted to know if we could sit down and discuss this. I wasn’t at home and got her message. I sent her an email asking what the goal of the meeting was, what were they prepared to share with me, who would be in attendance at the meeting, or if it would be the same old song delivered with a different voice. I did not get a response, and I did not get the report I was told would be ready in two days. On September 28th I phoned the Administrator asking what the decision was – She told me there had been a meeting with the City, and it was decided that they would not be giving me further information. Privacy issues. I asked if there had been a suspension/discipline, and she said yes, but she would say no more. She said there was a video which had been destroyed; it was taken in the bathroom while he was getting a bath, and it was supposedly just in fun. That is all the information I will get. I should move on and grieve my husband. How can I move on? My heart has been pounding ever since. I am so angry. I have retained a lawyer, and we are trying to find out the legislation and statute under which they refuse to give me information. If this does not work, I will not stop. I feel like I failed Rene; in his condition he couldn’t tell me anything. Now I HAVE to know, and there is also a principle involved here. Otherwise I will have no peace. They are protecting the wrong people. They thought this would just fade away, but the longer it goes and the more they refuse to give information, it makes me more and more stressed and determined. I found out the following: I don’t know when the incident happened – they won’t say, but it was before my husband passed (July 8th). It was reported to Management on the 13th of July, and then reported to the Ministry on July 20th. The Ministry did a full two-day investigation at the Home on this matter and interviewed PSWs, registered staff and 4 Management. They (MOH) will not tell me anything because of privacy laws. Their mandate is only to investigate – they go no further - WHO THE HELL WAS PROTECTING MY HUSBAND’S PRIVACY!!! The Ministry will not close their file under the Nursing Home completes their report. Problem is, I have tried and tried to get information, and after almost 3 months, the only thing the nursing home was saying ‘we’re still investigating”, and ”these things take a very long time”. (How come the Ministry could finish their investigation in 2 days). So, 1) it was in the bathroom 2) It was a woman PSW 3) There was a video that was destroyed 4) There was disciplinary action, but I am not allowed to know anything about that 5) The Union and various departments of the City were involved I took many videos of my husband during his illness. It started because the doctors did not see the problems he was having … videotaping helped tremendously to get him the different meds and help. I did not destroy these videos, but could not look at them – for me they are heartbreaking, and chronicle his confusion, yelling, and most everything involved in his descent deeper and deeper into Alzheimers. While I feel he is somehow always with me, to watch these videos is like seeing him suffering all over again. But perhaps now they, if need be, prove his condition, and show that he did not have any fun left in him. Just venting. It is so hard, and is all I can think about these days.
marg78, So sorry you have not been provided the answers you were promised. I honestly think management keeps putting caregivers off hoping we will forget or just give up. Just yesterday I saw a local news report about a snapchat video that was posted of an ALF patient using the bathroom. The video was sent to the TV station by a viewer. It is on WBTV.com. Click on video at top and the then click the ALF video. It is about a two and a half minute story. Made me madder than H**L. It is hard to believe that this kind of stuff goes on. I do hope you get resolution for your personal peace. Sending you a hug.
I watched the news report Alim - according to that it was a 'fireable' offense. If those that did the video of Rene were fired then that is probably about all that can be done short of civil suit. I can see if residents are smiling, laughing, etc. taking their picture, but what kind of sick mind wants to take a video of a resident on the toilet? That is just plain sick.
Marg - a civil suit might be the only thing left to do. But, I would demand a letter from the nursing home stating the employees involved were fired and ALL copies of the video were destroyed. Unfortunately, if it was sent out to others, there is no guarantee all copies were destroyed.
Then you will have to find a way to let it go. Remember - you did not fail him. This is not your fault or failure whatsoever. This was done by some mentally ill employees. Suggestion: write a letter or more (will probably take more than once) expressing your feelings, then burn or bury it/them as a way to end it.
hi Alim and Charlotte, Alim, I just watched that video, and I COULD NOT HELP MYSELF - I forwarded it to the Management. Thank you. Charlotte, the PSW was not fired, but they wont say what the discipline was - I have no right to know. What makes it so difficult for me is first, Rene's dignity, then the secretive way they covered it up and refused to let me know what happened. If it was innocent, they could have spoken to me. I am generally not a difficult person, but I was very protective of Rene. I feel that as caregivers we have the right to know. We trusted them with our loved ones. I do hope we dont have to go to a civil suit - I would hate that, but I need to know exactly what happened. I owe him that.
I should not be taking any action without consulting the lawyer, but I simply could not resist sending that video.
I still keep in touch with friends of my husband, and they said similar things had gone on in a nursing home in Switzerland, that citizens were outraged and there was a lot of press coverage and some were even charged.
I am mystified as to why the facility won't share the details of the resolution with you. Maybe Canada is different in this regard. Here in the U.S., I had an absolutely sub-par emergency room visit with Larry in July, 2013. The whole experience was so sub-standard that I detailed my complaints in writing to the Ombudsman. I was contacted immediately to discuss the situation by phone. Some time went by, but I received a detailed, written account of the resolution of my complaints. (Too long to recount here--but basically they did a big re-training of their ER staff...I'm not being facetious...it was that bad--and as a long-time nurse, I realized it and called them out on it.) When we had that nightmare day and night April 14, 2014, the emergency room experience could not have been better--and I don't think the staff that night knew who we were. So at least I felt good that Larry's last ER experience was up to professional standards, and that my bomb blast of their facility resulted in better care for all.
Anyway, Marg, I don't understand why you are not receiving something similar...some kind of written report detailing the complaint, the interventions made to correct the situation, and the resolution. (Retraining of entire staff, new written standards in policy manual...that kind of thing.) Frankly, if you can afford it, I would keep working with the lawyer...have him apply pressure to get you a little more information...or at least to provide you with a satisfactory explanation of the legal issues that would preclude this. (Again...it may be a Canadian thing--I just have no expertise up there.)
Past that, I think you'll have to let it go. Rene is at peace, I'm sure, and I think he would want you to be at peace, too. You have been a valiant advocate for him--and certainly an inspiration to the rest of us. Past a certain point, you can only do what you can do...and you have certainly done your best.
Elizabeth, It's the Unions, partially, and City liability, I think. They will not put anything in writing. My lawyer (a lady) is trying to get the information for me, and I trust her, so after venting here, I had better be quiet and know she is dealing with it. I think in time we will find out more, but after the stress they put me through, it will be nice to know they may be feeling the heat. Wish us luck.
So sorry about Larry's experience, but he was fortunate to have you, not only with your sense of right and wrong, but your experience must have helped a great deal. He was a very lucky man.
Dear marg78, I known nothing about Canadian law but the video from Charlotte, NC, certainly suggests some avenues you can look into. The Ministry of Health seems to be treating this as a regulatory matter but I wonder if it is a criminal offense as well. It certainly could be viewed as abuse of an elderly or disabled person. Ask you lawyer if you can report this to the police or file a criminal complaint (or whatever it is called there). Since you do not know the identity of the person who committed the crime, maybe you could accuse the NH, which gave the person access to your husband. Or . . . you could accuse the NH of tampering with evidence and concealing a crime. (Just thinking out loud, . . . none of this may be possible under the law of your province.) Also, just because you do not want money damages does not mean you cannot sue the nursing home for money and then later settle the case for a report of the facts about the incident. Again, ask your lawyer.
At some point, you'll need to back away from this, though. Last winter, about seven months after my husband was admitted to LTC, he was taken to the ER for a behavior problem, which was uncharacteristic of him. He was treated terribly there and when we got back to the facility, the unit nurse was arrogant and rude to him. As you know it is very hard to admit your spouse to a facility and at that time I was just beginning to get back on my feet emotionally but this incident caused me to flip out and lose all the ground I had gained in the preceding months. (Like you, my heart was pounding all the time and I had the same issue as yours - I was very protective of my husband.) My office assistant finally pointed out to me that I had become obsessed and told me I had to give it a rest. So I forced myself to consciously take long breaks from thinking about it. You need to do that, too, or else it will eat you up.
Thanks very much for your advice. When I saw that video, I simply copied the address onto an email, no comments, and just forwarded it to management. I do hope it makes them think. I will speak with the lawyer, but in spite of everything it might not be as bad as I feared. It might have been a stupid mistake, but the cover-up made things so much worse. I know what you mean when you say you were obsessed. I am feeling that way now. In the past few days that is the only thing that has been on my mind. I know Rene would not want me to get sick over this, and the thought of going into a nursing home is, as we all know and dread, scary. Thanks so much for your support. I am hoping that in the next few days I can begin to settle down a bit. And I will be relying on the lawyer.
marg78*, I had just signed out when I saw your post and had to sign in again to say how much I admire you for doing this. You did well by your husband.
Based on all the, "No comments" reported in this story, it's clear that the municipal union must be very powerful and that the newspaper was the only way you were going to get any information. Although I know nothing about Canadian law, I think it is safe to bet that elder abuse is a crime in Ontario and there may be a real question about whether the care facility should have reported the videotaping to the police for further investigation. I hope this newspaper story will put other personal care employees on notice that violating someone's privacy in this manner is a serious matter.
Wow. Just wow. I read the article carefully, twice. (You and Rene were such a lovely couple together, Margaret. Great picture!)
I'm glad they fired the staff member who did the video, but I still have a couple of questions. Why is that oversight committee still saying they don't know anything about it, blah, blah, blah. How is that even possible? How could they not know? And if it is the law in Ontario that these incidents must be reported to the police...well, why wasn't it reported? It sounds like the facility is making a scapegoat of the aide (albeit rightly so), but that the higher ups are still not being transparent about the fact that they did not handle this effectively and according to the law.
Margaret, you have done so many people a great service by pursuing this matter and bringing the facts to the light of day. If it protects only one patient it will be a good thing, but you have raised awareness that in the future will help many patients. What a brave and good thing you have done...while dealing with the sadness and bereavement of the loss of Rene. You are an inspiration for all of us.
Marg, well done you!!! You were never going to give up and you have been amazing, to keep pursuing this through your dreadful grief. As Elizabeth said, you have also done a great service for those who will follow in your husbands' footsteps (and it was such a well written story.) The picture of you both shows the love that you shared and that has come through in every post here, right from the very beginning so it was lovely to see your faces and know that you have righted the wrong done to this lovely man. Best wishes to you, Marg. XX
Myrtle and Elizabeth, There is a bit more to the story, but, after emailing my lawyer, she said it was a very fair representation of the facts, and she’s very happy about this. I have been working steadily on getting at the truth since Rene’s passing …. I just HAD to know what happened to him, because he was so vulnerable. Before hiring the lawyer I had been contacting the City and the Home, practically begging them to give me information. I do understand that the Administrator of the Home is in a bind … she cannot comment … and I really respect her for the way she is doing her job at the Home. But the lawyers at the City were so afraid that I would sue, and, of course, they have to be very careful about the powerful union, that they would give no information. So I asked my lawyer for help, and I met with the Administrator and the City lawyer, and at that time I expressed my concerns, saying this was the last thing I could do for my husband, but I also told the Administrator that I felt she was doing a very good job. But, no information…confidentiality. I did say, though, that I would persevere ... that I would never give up until I knew what happened. So I contacted the newspaper a few days ago. This afternoon I received a call from the Inspector from the Ministry. She apologized for the length of time it took to get back to me, but said she wanted to be certain that everything was in order, and that the Home did everything according to the law. She gave me the name of the detective she contacted – and she did give me a lot of information. She thinks, after her thorough investigation, that the PSW who did the videotape was not malicious, just not thinking. She said that it was reported late by the witnessing PSW, therefore the delay. She also said that in speaking with a lot of the staff, that her feeling was that they were sad when Rene passed, because they liked him very much (in spite of his yelling). She said many of the staff told her that. I have the name of the detective the MOH contacted, and I may phone him to find out exactly why he did not report it. I have ruffled so many feathers now, though. I am so grateful to the health reporter, who is excellent. He got me info that I probably would not have gotten for another year or two, and would have had to go to Discovery for. He writes a lot about seniors and LTC homes. I don't think I could have withstood another year or two of this stress. I was shocked that we made the front page of the newspaper, but perhaps families of residents in LTC may begin to realize that they should be checking on their elderly family more closely. And I believe that it will help other residents. I think Rene would approve of my actions. Thanks very much for your support. It is really appreciated. I feel now like such a weight has been lifted from my shoulders, and that perhaps Rene and I can both rest.
An update. I phoned the Officer that the Ministry of Health had spoken with, and while it is not totally clear, it might have been presented in a way that was sort of … the resident has passed, no video was found, and how could a charge be laid without that material. It was a good conversation. The next morning I got a visit from a Detective … a file has now been opened and he took all my material to study. He said it might take a few weeks or a few months, but he will work on this, and if there is a video he will find it. I told him I wanted to see the video if he can find it. He feels that what appears to have happened would be criminal. My lawyer has the Freedom of Information request on a Bring Forward. Then the reporter phoned. He thinks he might do a follow-up. He wanted the names of the Detective and the MOH inspector, and I am assuming he wants to speak with them. It is out of my hands now. It feels like a huge weight has been lifted off my shoulders because before it was just working alone … now I have you-all, the lawyer, the police and the reporter. It’s hard to verbalize my gratitude for all your comments, advice and suggestions. I don’t know where I would be now without your help. This is such a wonderful site, and people are so helpful and kind to each other. I read almost every day, sometimes several times a day, and my heart aches for the stress and pain that you are all still enduring whose spouses are still suffering. Thank you all.
Thanks, Myrtle. Your help has been so much appreciated. The load feels lighter with all the help I am getting, but I also remember the weight of the load you are carrying, because I remember when my husband was dealing with the disease. Thank you for your support Cassie. I love you guys.
The site doesn't always work smoothly...sometimes seems to take a while to get "Discussions" to open up and function properly. At least that's been my experience recently.
Hi, Thanks for your interest. Here goes: I am glad I went to the newspaper, because some things have happened since then. The City does not want publicity. At first they cited Personal Information, but they have since backed down on that because I was his Power of Attorney, wife, caregiver and his support during these years of Alzheimer's.
When we were filing for FOI, they made us go through channels, file the applications, and about 2 days before the time period was up, sent this letter, citing: ‘The records responsive to your request relate to meetings, consultations, discussion or communications about labour relations or employment-related matters in which The Corporation of the City of London has an interest. Therefore pursuant to Section 52(3) of the Act, any records which may be responsive to your request are excluded from the access provisions of the Act and therefore your request is denied.’
It was a farce – they knew all along that they would give us nothing. Now we can appeal to the Information and Privacy Commissioner of Ontario within 30 days of their letter. I believe they are protecting themselves because there may be a grievance by a powerful union.
The Detective told me that this week he will be interviewing the PSW who reported the incident, and hopefully the PSW who supposedly took the video. She can refuse to speak with him, and if that’s the case, it is her right. He is also checking on when they phoned the Police. He said that if there is anything to this, he will notify me.
I was very disappointed in the MOH report. It did not say that the inspector had been at the Home August 11th and 12th specifically to investigate this. She says her duty with the MOH is only to make sure that the regulations laid down are followed; the Home is responsible for the investigation.
I had said I was not interested in suing, just in finding out exactly when happened to Rene. In my opinion this could have been settled quickly if they had sat down and been totally honest with me. I was not (until now) an unreasonable person.
It was suggested that maybe the City might give me information if I signed an agreement not to disclose anything to the press or others, they might tell me more. If such a thing happened I would never sign until I had all information, because after this FOI problem I do not trust them. They are ONLY looking after their own interests, and don’t care at all about anything else.
As Myrtle advised previously, this can consume you; it has certainly consumed my life since Rene’s passing, and I should think of backing away. If I hang in, it may allow others to get information they are entitled to. On the other hand, I would hate to give in, because we are supposed to be living in a free country, and the aspect of ‘big brother and governments’ controlling even our right to question goes against everything I believe in. Any comments/advice? I am trying very hard to figure out what is right, and any comments or advice would be appreciated.
‘The records responsive to your request relate to meetings, consultations, discussion or communications about labour relations or employment-related matters in which The Corporation of the City of London has an interest. Therefore pursuant to Section 52(3) of the Act, any records which may be responsive to your request are excluded from the access provisions of the Act and therefore your request is denied.’
I was thinking to respond by citing the following to the Legal Department of the City of London: ‘The records responsive to my request for information under the Freedom of Information and Privacy Act relate to the care, dignity and respect of my husband, who I entrusted to your care when I was not with him. Any matter relating to his care is something in which I, Margaret Karrer, his Power of Attorney, wife, caregiver and best friend, have a very personal interest. Therefore pursuant to my conscience, and sense of what is right and wrong, I find your actions totally self-serving.’
I guess I am going too far, but I've just had a glass of wine. What do you think?
Thank you sincerely for your support, Jazzy. I am on the other end of this disease now, and my heart truly feels for what you are going through with Kevan. There was another caregiver at the same time as my husband's stay with Lewy Body, and I know it was so difficult for her to cope with all the problems his disease and his actions as a result of his disease presented.
For me it's different now, and I thank God that my husband's suffering, confusion, anxiety are over. This problem now just needs to get a solution. I think you are doing a fantastic job for Kevan ... keep the faith ... you will get through it. So happy that your new home is friendly and welcoming.