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    • CommentAuthorAdmin
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008 edited
     
    In answer to your requests and my own husband's request, I have started a new topic about this strange phenomenon. first discussed in the "What do you think causes AD thread?" So many of our AD spouses seem to have a red blotch on the back of their heads. This is a TOTALLY UNSCIENTIFIC survey, but I do wonder about it, and will ask the neurologist next week, who will probably laugh me out of his office. I will also get my crack scientist college roommate on the trail to see if she can come up with anything.

    In the meantime, I am placing all of the comments about the red patch from the "What do you think causes AD?" thread here, and anyone can jump in with observations about the back of their spouse's head. Note that if you referred to something else other than the red patch in your previous post, I DID NOT post it here. This thread is for RED PATCH ONLY.

    joang
    • CommentAuthorAdmin
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    CommentAuthorMary CommentTime23 hours ago
    Do any of your spouses have a red spot (about an inch or so big, but not really circular, more like the state of Iowa) at the base of their skulls? It's almost like a birth mark, but sometimes it is redder than other times; sometimes it is a light brown. He's had it for years, but wasn't born with it. The thought just hit me to mention it to see if anyone else's spouse has one.

    My husband has not had a head injury nor been involved in a traffic accident. They first thing he had wrong with him didn't occur until 1996 (he's always been healthy), when we discovered a blood clot in the artery of his right thigh. By the time the doctors were through with his surgery and recovery (he almost bled to death) they managed to save him. After six more years, all of these new symptoms started showing up - hands shaking; sleep apnea; restless leg syndrome; and vision perception. Whether these symptoms are related to his AD, I don't know.

    I have not bothered to do any research on the causes of AD, but will gladly listen to all who have a theory!
    • CommentAuthorAdmin
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    CommentAuthordivvi CommentTime22 hours ago
    Mary that really creepy. my DH has exactly your red blotch at nape of skull like you say.its redder some days more than others, i noticed it when i started bathing him several yrs ago. i dont think he had it either from birth. this is really strange. wonder if anyone else? i am under the belief its an exposure to toxins accumlulated over a lifetime and or infections and or a combo of bacteria and parasites. esp parasites. like fluke worms or something that can cause a permanent inflammation. i have seen just recently that my DH started on 100mg of neurontin which is used for diebetic neuropathy pain issues. he has improved a LOT just in a few wks of using this new drug. not only has it stopped the myclonous jerking alltogether, but his speech and whole demeanor has significantly improved in my own opinion. i think its working to reduce the inflamatory process in the brain signaling somehow. all i know is hes doing much better as a whole. so i think they could be on to something with the idea of ibiprofen and antiinflammory being a good start too. also i have my DH on a low dose of permanent antiobiotics so maybe this is helping with some infection and or bacterias in the brain. its alot to think about. i am going to take a stronger look into parasites and how they could be affecting the body esp the brain. divvi
    • CommentAuthorAdmin
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008 edited
     
    sandy CommentTime21 hours ago
    Divvi and Mary-how weird that you should mention that. My husband has had a mark like that for years. Since we lived in far out places in the mining field I always cut his hair and always just considered it a birthmark. You have described it perfectly. Sandy
    • CommentAuthorAdmin
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    CommentAuthorAdmin CommentTime21 hours ago
    Okay, this is CREEEEEPY. I just checked the back of Sid's head, and he DOES have a red mark under his hair.

    joang
    • CommentAuthorAdmin
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    CommentAuthordivvi CommentTime21 hours ago
    ok. this is quite strange, in the last hr 4 of us have seen this uncanny red blotch at the base of the skull/neck in our AD spouse. my DH is very red today more than usual. we need everyone to get back with us on this. it cant be all just coincidence or???
    LET US KNOW!
    • CommentAuthorAdmin
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    CommentAuthorJanet CommentTime15 hours ago

    My husband has the red patch and brown eyes.

    Janet
    • CommentAuthorAdmin
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    CommentAuthordivvi CommentTime15 hours ago

    this is getting stranger by the minute...my jaw dropped, yet another one...if not associated directly to AD or such, it COULD be a new side effect from the alz meds they are all taking or taken or something in common...???? divvi
    • CommentAuthorAdmin
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    CommentAuthorKitty CommentTime14 hours ago

    OMG! What's up with this? Divvi, I'm with you, I have a need to know. This CANNOT be coincidence!
    • CommentAuthorKitty
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    Could we rename this "Red spot on back of head - sign of AD?"

    Seems Marsh mentioned something too.
  1.  
    My husband doesn't have a red splotch so maybe that means he has the Vascular Dementia and Not AD?????? I personally
    have never thought he had most of the AD symptoms, so just thought I would put my 2 cents in.
    •  
      CommentAuthorNikki
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    I posted this in the other thread, I went checking my whole family for red spots. My mom is the only one who has one, but she doesn't have any form of dementia. I wish she wasn't so stubborn I would take her to the doctor to see what it is. Have any of you ever mentioned this to a doctor or dermatologist? Let us know what your doctor says Joan.
  2.  
    No red patch but Bill has FTD
    • CommentAuthorMissB
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    Not only is this creepy but it is weirding me out. My DH also has the exact same red blotch. He says he always thought it was a birthmark. How can there be that many coincidences?
    • CommentAuthordivvi*
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    yes Marsh commented his wife had a faint red blotch too he had never noticed before..
    • CommentAuthorKadee*
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    I also posted on the previous thread. My husband also has the red markings at the base of his skull, he was not born with it. Started out as a small red mark, however, I have noticed recently where it is about 2-3 inches up his head now.
    • CommentAuthorKitty
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    Would that make 8? Just on this site?
    • CommentAuthorMissB
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2008
     
    I count 9 so far........WOW!
    • CommentAuthorKitty
    • CommentTimeAug 3rd 2008
     
    jav made a comment on the other thread, her husband also has the red patch on the back of his head.
    • CommentAuthorKitty
    • CommentTimeAug 3rd 2008
     
    Anyone who goes to in person support groups could ask their group & report back here.
    • CommentAuthorSunshyne
    • CommentTimeAug 3rd 2008
     
    Hate to rain on the parade, but I've done a little Googling, and what you're seeing is called a "salmon patch", which is a very common "capillary vascular malformation" seen in about 40% of all newborns. Salmon patches are commonly found at the nape of the neck (stork bite), on the forehead between the eyebrows (angel's kiss) or on the eyelids. They become more intense in color and noticeable when the child is crying. Most lesions will spontaneously disappear within the first year of life. However, stork bites tend to be more persistent and may remain unchanged into adult life in 50% of cases. They are always present at birth, although they may become more obvious with time.
    • CommentAuthordivvi*
    • CommentTimeAug 3rd 2008
     
    that may be true and good to know, sunshyne, but i had it called to my attention by my DH hairdresser last time he was in june who has cut his hair 15yrs. she never saw it before either. and his is spreading its bigger than before -it just seems strange that it would be so common among the AD spouses here and not us who dont have AD. i dont have it nor does my son or mother. divvi
  3.  
    Sunshyne, my husband did not have one until a few years ago. It was NOT present at birth. That is why I brought it up at all. You are great at googling - so see if there are any articles where it appears in people's 50s and 60s... <grin>

    I doubt if any scientist will bother to research this and some will pooh-pooh it, but since it had been a fairly recent occurrence with my husband, and his sometimes gets bright red and sometimes turns pinkish brown, I thought I would see if others had noticed it.
    • CommentAuthorjav*
    • CommentTimeAug 4th 2008
     
    i have always been told by my mother that these were birthmarks,but i never questioned before, why do so many people have the same birthmark? what causes it and why? my sister also has this birthmark,that is why i was aware of these at a young age. my dh also has this red patch. it does seem to show up more at times,seems reder[is that a word?]. if i just cut his hair and he doesn't have as much suntan on his neck it definately shows more. is that were the word ' REDNECK" comes from? lol jav
    • CommentAuthordivvi*
    • CommentTimeAug 4th 2008
     
    maybe it could be some type of vascular constriction thats not assoc with birth markings? you can see little marked red veins in my husbands if you look closely-like mary, ours is something new and not from birth and like Kadee's is spreading up the back of the head. it may or not be salmon patch, but then again it could be something assoc with maybe a alz med that all have been on at some point..whatever it is its strange. divvi
    • CommentAuthorSunshyne
    • CommentTimeAug 4th 2008
     
    For far more than you ever wanted to know about "birthmarks" -- angiomas and vascular malformations including port wine stains, salmon patches, strawberry hemangiomas, Mongolian spots, cherry angiomas, and Cafe au lait spots, see:

    http://www.answers.com/topic/birthmark

    http://www.aafp.org/afp/980215ap/wirth.html

    http://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/bhcv2/bhcarticles.Nsf/pages/Birthmarks?OpenDocument

    http://www.anaisdedermatologia.org.br/artigo_en.php?artigo_id=100

    http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_g2601/is_0002/ai_2601000201

    Birthmarks that are found at birth are called "congenital", whereas those that develop later in life are called "acquired." Some references stated that the salmon patch (nevus simplex, nevus telangiectaticus, Unna's nevus) may develop later in life; others said that the "acquired" salmon patch lesions are insufficient in size during childhood to be noticeable but become evident in adult years.

    In fair-skinned children (and presumably adults), salmon patch erythema may persist or reappear during episodes of crying, physical exertion or breath-holding.

    Spider veins are a type of acquired hemangioma that occur during pregnancy in 70% of white women and 10% of black women, in alcoholics and liver disease patients, and in 50% of children.

    Most birthmarks do not hurt; most do not cause any health problems and do not need treatment. However, some, such as congenital melanocytic naevus, may need to be removed because they may be a cancer risk, or because the child finds the mark distressing. Very occasionally, port wine stain birthmarks may indicate the presence of a rare underlying disorder.
  4.  
    Thank you, Sunshyne! Now, my husband is fair-skinned. and if crying, physical exertion or breath-holding is a trigger, don't all of those show shortages of oxygen? Even for short periods of time? And with my husband, he has sleep apnea, COPD, etc., more shortages of oxygen. hhmmmm.........

    I'll ready those sites tonight when I have time... Thank you for looking them up!
  5.  
    Cafe au lait spots almost always appear with certain types of intestinal cancer. Embryos develop unrelated party of the body at the same time-That's why German Measles causes three unrelated defects if the mom gets it in the first trimester of pregnancy. Wouldn't it be incredible if the defect causing some types of dementia would have another identifier-like the red patch.
    • CommentAuthorAdmin
    • CommentTimeAug 4th 2008
     
    My scientist friend is on this one. She is doing research for me. If she comes up with anything different than your research, I'll let you know.

    joang
  6.  
    ttt
  7.  
    ttt
    • CommentAuthorjoyful*
    • CommentTimeJan 7th 2009
     
    I was looking at my husbands hair today to ascertain a possible need for a haircut and noticed a red spot on the nape of his head where he had not had one. This is recent....He has or did have beautiful crystal clear blue eyes. I am interested in finding what common elements that our spouses who have red spots on the head share. There is probably a common thread running through this populatiion. I wonder if we could do some research with our spouses who are exhibiting these shared features. Could we come up with a checklist for these people that includes various factors: environmental, medical, medications, region where they live. etc.? I think this is a trait shared that might be more thancoincidence. What do you think?
    • CommentAuthordivvi*
    • CommentTimeJan 7th 2009
     
    joyful if you read this whole topic there are many of us who have the red patch on spouse...its very wierd and no real explanation. i do think its more than coincidence that so many of our AD spouses have it though. i dont buy its a birthmark either. ours appeared many yrs ago after AD but has gotten much bigger and seems to be redder some days. we have hashed out some debating over it in the posts plus the other post about WAG what causes AD topic has more on it.. maybe some of the new members can check and let us know if their spouse has one too. its just plain spooky. Divvi
  8.  
    Joan was having someone do research on the red spot. There were several reasons for a red spot at the nape of the neck found when you google, but after reading them, I didn't see where they would apply to my husband. I still think that there may be a connection, but it may take years to discover it. It's too bad we don't have Alzheimer's researchers reading our discussions and putting all of the symptoms, where they live, what jobs they had, whether they were involved in an accident, whether they had Lewey Bodies, Frontal Lobe, MCI, EOAD, Parkinson's, what other illnesses that they had at the same time - COPD, High Cholesterol, PAD, PVD, etc., and what went first - eye perception, hearing loss, taste, smell, personality changes, etc.

    If I had the time, I would do an Excel chart and try to put all of this together. It's got to be of help to those researching Alzheimer's, but I don't. Maybe after......
    • CommentAuthorAdmin
    • CommentTimeJan 8th 2009
     
    Yes, my scientific researcher came up with a definitive answer on that one. It is called a "stork's bite", and it is a birthmark, having nothing to do with AD. Here is the link to a simple explanation - http://www.drhull.com/EncyMaster/S/stork_bite.html

    Here is a link to a picture - http://www.chsd.org/images/medtips/stork_bite1.jpg This one is quite large. Sid's is rather small.

    By the way, my scientific researcher (besides Sunshyne) is my college roommate who has a Ph.D in biochemistry - we reconnected via e-mail when I let her and everyone else know about this website. She has been a great help.

    joang
    • CommentAuthordivvi*
    • CommentTimeJan 8th 2009
     
    Joang, i dont buy the storks bite theory as many of our spouses have not had this from birth..some are only noticing it now and sur it wasnt there before. plus my DH is getting larger and up his head. much larger than orginal when noticed. plus i looked storks bite on various sites and it says most of the time the birthmark is temporary and common yes but. usually gone by 3rd yr...

    this seems different to me than that explanation..
    but i have none to offer in rebuttal! divvi
    • CommentAuthorRk
    • CommentTimeJan 8th 2009
     
    hmmmm, I saw this on another topic today. And wondered about my Dh. Unfortunetly I can't check his head as he is down in Denver visiting his Mom for a few days, but I am sure he has the red spot. And being a hairstylist I have seen a lot of birth marks and this one is very different. And the fact that my family has some really off the wall birth marks so the birth mark topic is always a good subject. I am with divvi in that I think there may be more to it. Hopefully someday someone will actually investagate it further. Rk
  9.  
    I agree with divvi. My husband did not have this mark as a child, nor when we married. It came a few years ago. Definitely not a birthmark.

    I'm open to other explanations, and given the number of AD patients with this mark, there has to be something. No one has brought it up with AD patients before us. We're pioneers! <grin>
    • CommentAuthordivvi*
    • CommentTimeJan 9th 2009
     
    my hunch is that its some sort of vaso-dialated nerve endings produced either by the dementia-AD issues themselves OR an unknown effect of a common drug we are or have all given for AD.(AD MEDS?which most of us used at one time or another...thats my 2cents worth up to now..i wish new members would reply if theirs has it or not. i do think it should be done a common thread those of us who have the spot and have used which AD drugs..maybe one in particular is a link...Divvi
  10.  
    ttt for phranque and other newbies (I hate the term because it makes me an oldie)
    • CommentAuthorscs
    • CommentTimeApr 3rd 2009
     
    This is crazy...today noticed the red mark at the base of Tom's skull. Know I have seen it before but am pretty sure it was not there a few years ago. Stumbled on this thread.. Need to watch more closely and see if it comes and goes. To my knowledge, most of the common AD drugs do not cause vasodilation. Need to do some investigating!
  11.  
    scs this is one of the great values of Joan's site. Those of us who have been around for a while remember subjects discussed before and like to include new folks in old discussions. Pretty neat-eh what?
    • CommentAuthorscs
    • CommentTimeApr 4th 2009
     
    Not sure what I like best reading about...the wonderful information, great sense of support or the sheer joy of looking for lost pj's! You are all pretty special ... oldbies, experts, mentors, navigators,...can think of many words to describe you! All good!
    • CommentAuthorKadee*
    • CommentTimeApr 4th 2009
     
    My husband's red mark seems to be spreading both up & across, is this happening to others?
    • CommentAuthordivvi*
    • CommentTimeApr 5th 2009
     
    kadee, my DH's has also spread and much larger than a when we posted-. and from initial posts since then, hes off all AD meds so it cant be the AD meds i guess. i think its just the damn disease doing something to the vessels. Divvi
    • CommentAuthorKadee*
    • CommentTimeApr 5th 2009
     
    divvi, I agree, it has to be the disease. I also think the sharp pains in my husband's head are due to what is happening to his brain.
    • CommentAuthordivvi*
    • CommentTimeApr 5th 2009
     
    and its NOT a birthmark -no way.
  12.  
    Right on - it is not a birthmark. Too many AD patients have it. No one knows the significance of it yet. Scientists try to fluff it off.
    •  
      CommentAuthorSusan L*
    • CommentTimeApr 5th 2009
     
    If my back didn't hurt so much, I'd run downstairs to check his head right now, but as I sit/lay here reclined with my laptop, I will need to wait til he comes up here. Will get back to you all, but then he has FTD, so maybe not. hmmm
    • CommentAuthorKadee*
    • CommentTimeApr 5th 2009 edited
     
    Susan, Sorry about your back. My husband also has FTD. Also agree not a birthmark.