About 2 years ago I found this site while trying to figure out my husband's new personality change. Didn't want to believe it, and kicked him out after a 42 year marriage. He has begged to come back numerous times and loving him so much, I allowed it. Everytime I let him back, I see more and more of what all you wonderful people out there wrote to me at the beginning of my search. He still won't admit he has a problem, so no diagnosis is possible. But he has developed such a hair-trigger temper worse and worse. We had a wonderful 40 year marriage, with never showing such behavior. When I leave the room, and not engage in his bad behavior, it vanishes in a short time and he's back to as normal as normal is now. He very rarely shows any empathy for me now, except when he wants intimacy. But found out even after, his loving behavior wanes. He tells me I've changed, not him. His father, at the same age, changed in personality to his wife too. And my husband at 22 years old, confided in me that he didn't know who his father was anymore. When I try to remind him of that, he says he should have never even told me about his father. Well, I have put him out for the last time. Just can't take it anymore and am getting physically ill from it. My 2 sons don't want to believe what I tell them, and one has turned on me almost completely. I feel so alone and broken hearted. Although I didn't want to believe what I first read here, I do NOW. Please help me, I am desperate and so despondent. Am now doing No Contact for my sanity and physical problems.
I am sorry for you pain. And to me, it sounds like you may benefit from reading extensively on this site, and go to a support group, and BELIEVE!! ginaginaz, my husband of age 64, went from just a bit forgetful 2 and a half years ago, to wheelchair bound, not speaking, totally incontinent and spoon fed....this is REAL!!
I am sad for you, and also for him. Please get some help, reach out, talk to a social worker, doctor, a professional.
Thank you so much, Coco. I do believe now. Spoke to my Doctor and he said for my well-being I need to find a new handyman PDQ, or I will have a stroke. I have been coming back and forth to this site even while I was hoping it wasn't the problem. He always says he loves me, but his new hurtful behavior will always come through eventually in one form or another.He can still drive, cook when he's living on his own, shop for food and socialize with his new neighbors. He has bought and walked away from 3 different single=wides he bought every time I put him out. He comes back so much like the man I have loved forever, but it just never lasts.And the good window with Jekyll is getting smaller and smaller, while Hyde seems to be more in control. I know when the transformation takes place just by his voice and look on his face. He has my 2 sons thinking I have paranoia and that I am the one who's changed. When he's living alone, he always comes to help me manage maintenance at my home. But He wants intimacy now from me even while he is still living in his place. I told him I am not his booty call and then his hair=trigger temper kicks in and he is oblivious to any rational conversation. In fact, when I kept taking him back, and we would have intimacy, he became such a selfish lover, it just blew me away. When I started mentioning that change in him, he promises it won't happy any more. SURE!! Then Forgotten. We are married 45 years and being without him is killing me. I told him last week..I miss you when you are NOT living with me..BUT I miss you SO MUCH MORE when you ARE living with me. There is no reasoning with him at all anymore. But if you met him today, you would never notice his affliction. That's why my sons don't believe me. Daddy says it's all you...you are the one who changed. I've always had a wonderful close relationship with my sons, and now when I need their comfort and support, they believe their father and buy me books on Paranoia!!!! He's almost 69 and I'm 65. I noticed the changes about 5 years ago, but it came on so gradually back then. How do I stop obssessing over this heartbreak?
I don't think you ever stop obsessing over the heartbreak. It took my BIL a year before he believed anything was wrong with DH. And his own brother almost just as long.
Coco, We are right there with you. little over three and a half years ago DH was working, driving, etc. To hospice care, and declining day by day. DH is now 62.
My thoughts...to stop obsessing over the heartbreak. Well you will always have the pain,...but to stop obsessing? ACCEPT ACCEPT ACCEPT , and do NOT LOOK AT HIM THE SAME WAY. I am sorry this may seem harsh, but if he has AD, he WILL advance, he WILL change, and he WILL NOT ever be the same guy. Yes I have hurt so much too, I did not have a violent mate but a soft sweet one, and so hurtful to watch him leave all of us. You must, accept, to keep sane, and you must pray or seek help outside of his illness. You will cry and cry missing him, and you are not alone.
Ginaginaz so sorry you have to correlate what was said here prior. yes they do these things and nobody can make this stuff up! so sorry you are living in the nightmare as many of us are. try to find therapy help whatever you have at your disposal. the first stages are the more difficult I think.
I just had to pop back and say, sorry Ginaginaz if my last comment came off as mean in any way. I simply re live what YOU have felt, and divvi is right, is so many ways the first stages are the hardest. If there is one more thing I can say to help you, is this...do not expect him to understand what is happening, and sadly one of the things that go quickly is empathy for others. I think they just cannot grasp what is happening. I am so very sorry for your sadness.
Gina, welcome back. I too am sorry you need to return but you will find a lot of people on the site who have been through very similar situations who can give you advice, support and understanding. I remember your situation well.
I was in your position not too long ago. I saw my husband transform into a person I no longer knew. He became short-tempered, mean and hateful to me, but the world didn't see this master in disguise. As time went on, his behavioral changes became worse and worse. This is the earlier stages of the Alzheimer's journey....each stage (7 stages) has its difficulties and the earlier stage (undiagnosed) is the most difficult in coming to terms.
Make an appointment with your family doctor (with a list of all your concerns) along with documents of dates/times. Don't give up. If your doctor is not listening to you, you need to find a physician who will. Your husband needs to be diagnosed. The sooner he is diagnosed the sooner you will be able to accept that he will never be the man you married. The sooner you get him diagnosed the sooner you can start to make legal preparation for the future. This is not easy....I know...every single one of us here knows.
I am sorry for your sadness. It's a lonely journey and your son may never truly accept it even when your husband is in the advanced stages. Read the many posts and you will see that this is not common.
Ginaginaz, It doesn't matter if HE admits he has a problem, if TESTING proves he does. One doesn't ask an AD person if they believe they have AD, and neither should you. Make an appointment with his doctor, and then make up a fiblet and say they called him in for some testing. DO NOT mention AD or any problem YOU observe, .. and then go with him. Get the doctor involved, ... and once there, see what they believe.
You should not go through all of this pressure. If the doctor diagnoses his ailment, whatever it is, .. through a PET scan, blood DNA, MRI, CT Scan, MMSE, (and all the other possible tests)., then the boys cannot argue. Paranoia is definitely an early stage. I had a terrible time during this period. You have to get the doctors to see him,.. and you should ask the doctors to help you.
Coco, Blue, Divvi......Thank you all for taking the time to respond. Since he is living on his own again, and I've decided for my own health to go No Contact, I worry that I will have no way of knowing just how much he will be regressing and to what extent. What I did notice is that he has become more regimented in his daily routine...bike riding, going to the discount counters of several supermarkets everyday, watching Fox Cable News religiously, watching TV constantly, talks only about politics, cooking recipes, and what he's going to cook. He's become so boring and compulsive in his new interests. We always would go out for dinner and dancing on the weekend. Now he may take me if I'm a real good Stepford Wife, otherwise it seems he pushes my buttons until I refuse to go out, knowing it will not be fun anymore anyway. Is this normal in this stage?? The change in personality started between 4 and 5 years ago. Still drives, but just recently got 2 tickets for red light violations. That's totally new for him. He acts so normal when socializing though.. which still mystifies me and kept me from believing he had dementia. But his lack of empathy for me is the biggest change I see. All our long-time friends can't believe it because he was always so loving and doted on me more than any woman would want. Now, when I say OUCH, he seems to not care at all most of the time. He can still fix things around the house. I asked for a divorce and he couldn't understand why.....and said there's still hope for us to fix our marriage, if I would only stop my way of thinking and that he still loves me. Can anyone guess from what I describe what stage he may be in?? And also, with No Contact, how do I stop worrying about what he will do next?
TO LFL So thankful for your comments and that you recall my earlier tales of woe. And here I am again....A TRUE AND RELUCTANT BELIEVER. I am glad I learned all I did the last time I was writing on this wonderful site because it did help me know how to diffuse his anger from becoming violent as it had been happening. TO LULLIEBIRD He refuses to go to a doctor and says I am the one who needs help. He has a heart stent and hasn't gone for his yearly stress tests in 3 years. He has a growth in his lung and won't go for his yearly tests for that in 3 years. He had always gone like clockwork for these annual tests before. Can't reason with him at all. But thank you for your kind words for me. TO NANCY B As you will read what I responded to Lulliebird above........He is so adamant and won't even go to our GP for anything. Won't even take his meds for high cholesterol. And believe it or not, I think he is still way too functioning to even try fooling him with any ploy I could come up with. But thanx for your suggestion. Maybe next year he won't be so cunning as he still appears to be now. And what's with that anyway?????? STILL CUNNING???????? IS THAT POSSIBLE?????
Gina, I do hear your desperation. I offer my heartfelt empathy. I just placed my husband in assisted living 2 weeks ago. I guess I was fortunate because he never exhibited any of the aggression that you describe and has been very compliant and never wandered. I first noticed symptoms in 2006 and he was diagnosed in 2008 by his geriatrician. I doubt you can do much if he refuses to see the doctor. As the disease progresses, he will not be capable of making decisions although he will think he can. Have you considered divorce? I know that is a desperate decision but is an option. At least you would not be liable if he messes up. Like you the first symptom I noticed was lack of empathy and interest in anything. He would just lay on the couch. He then started forgetting constantly. I think your biggest next hurdle will be the driving issue. Once I found out that if an Alz patient has an accident you can be held liable for damages, that scared me and I called the insurance company and removed him from our policy. We are here for you and we care.
My DH was great early in our marriage. Then about 15+ years ago, it started to go bad. Little by little. He once blew a gasket because I gave him a spoon instead of a fork with his beef stew for dinner. I had always given him a spoon. That was what every day was like, something so little would set him off. And he would stay mad at me for the day. I have a crack in the living room wall where he punched it. And this was from a man who was so sweet and kind to me. He was a type A personality and workaholic but nice to me early on. Once he was dx and on meds he calmed back down to the man who he was before. One thing I will never forget was the look he would give me in the later years. It was a look like he wished I was dead. It would send chills threw me. I don't know what you should do. I know you need to protect yourself. If he is out and about and has an accident, you could be on the hook for any damage he does. This in not a easy way to live. Hugs
TO CO2...I so appreciate your kind words and advice. I'm sure these last couple of weeks have been awful for you to endure too. I so wish you all the peace you can possibly get during this terrible time. I was going to get a divorce last month and after discussing it with an attorney, he asked me a question about my husband's pension and what would happen if we divorced. Well, when he retired he took the choice to take a smaller monthly check, and in return when he died, AS HIS SPOUSE, i WOULD CONTINUE TO RECEIVE HIS MONTHLY CHECKS. That's that because I can't afford to live without that monthly check in the even of his death. I already had taken him off my car insurance but the agent said that as long as he is my husband, they can still come after me financially. So what do I do now??? TO BLUE...OMG I know that look you mentioned. It is almost like demonic possession. The eyes, the whole face change and it is scary and horrific to witness. And usually happens whenever I say "Ouch" about something cruel he did to me. And then he goes crazy, yelling, face turning purple, arms flailing and punch the air. I keep waiting for his entire head to spin around his dam neck, like in The Exorcist. A little humor there. But it is an awful experience to witness after being married 45 years of such a calm and loving husband. And when I think he is stil in the early stages, I just want to run away. That's why we're living apart again, but this time it is for good....for my sake. But thanx so much for responding to my plea for help. My heart and love go out to all of you great caring people on this site.
You can't wash your hands of this because you are still legally responsible as his wife. Go to the police and report the threatening things he's been doing, tell them everything, that he has dementia, likely Alzheimer's, and that you fear for your safety--if not your life--and that's true. Then meet with him or take him back, keep your cell phone on you at all times and the next time he acts up, call the police immediately, tell them he's threatening and frightening you and they will take him away to a facility where he will be examined--whether he wants to see a doctor or not. It's not his decision to make. I don't think you understand that his brain cells are dying and he cannot respond in a normal way to anything that happens or whatever you say--you're wasting your breath explaining anything or reasoning with him. You have an obligation to TAKE CHARGE because he can't be left to roam around, driving and doing who knows what. You have a normal functioning brain, he does not. He's like a child and you, as the adult, have to TAKE CHARGE. Living apart will not protect you. For YOUR sake and for his, TAKE CHARGE! Get the police involved, they've dealt with this before. Harsh as this sounds, I understand your feelings. I've been there and my DH was taken away by the police when he became violent in a care facility. They didn't put up with it for a minute. The man who would take a bullet for me, raged that he could kill me, eyes bulging, red face, fists flailing, and I'm not the only one who's had this happen. You can't let this go on. This is the 'for worse' part none of us thought about as a young bride, but it is what it is.
Gina, Bettyhere* has given you very good advice. Since you are still legally married to him, you are responsible, even though you're living apart. So any harm or damage he may cause with involve you and your finances as well. The only way you can avoid any liability is to divorce him. That is a difficult decision and many of us (including me) considered it but made the decision to stay and live the nightmare because of love.
If you cannot get him to a doctor, Betty's advice is certainly one way to get him in a medical facility and diagnosed, however it is a difficult road to go. You will need to be prepared for the police to arrest him, possibly put him in jail and then take him to a hospital for a medical evaluation. That's what happened to my husband when I called the police due to his violence. They did not care that he had dementia and arrested him for domestic abuse.
Regarding your spousal benefit from his pension...if you divorce him you would still be entitled to receive some of his pension while he's still alive and the portion you would receive after he died. Your attorney would have to petition for it in the divorce and since you've been married for over 40 years you would be granted those pensions benefits in the divorce settlement (but your attorney MUST make it part of the divorce).
I am sorry these last 2+ years have been difficult for you...the early stages are definitely the hardest because we have to deal with a spouse who is behaving and treating us badly for seemingly no apparent reason. We feel betrayed, bewildered, sad, desperate, you name it. But as Betty says, it is now way past time for YOU TO TAKE CHARGE. By now you know he's not getting better, only worse. It is time for you to face what is happening and put together an action plan to protect yourself and your assets. Also so he can be kept safe. I cannot stress how important it is now for you to deal with these issues, even though it is difficult. Perhaps you can hire an elder law attorney who can help get the legal paperwork in order...DPOA, new wills, living will, etc.
Based on your description of his behavior and the length of time it's been going on, I am GUESSING that he's probably in stage 3 or possibly stage 4. Trust me, now is the time to get your ducks in a row when he is still competent to agree to legally change things. If you miss this opportunity now, it will become difficult if not almost impossible to get things changed when he's further along in his disease because he will be considered incompetent.
One final piece of advice...read everything you can about dementia. It does help you deal with what's happening, what to anticipate as his disease progresses. And of course you can always come here for support and advice. Sorry you had to return but I am hopeful this website and the members will help you through some of your darkest hours. I know they have and still do for me. There is no way I could have gotten this far without the wonderful people here.
I don't have very much to add except been there done that....what a tough road that I wouldn't wish on anyone.
Question regarding your sons - would they be willing to read material about dementia? I realize it must be hard for them to accept that their dad is leaving them with this disease but if they could learn about it they could be a better support system for you and him. Maybe even get them to read what has been posted here.
TO BETTYHERE....How do I go to the police when all he does NOW, is carry on like a lunatic when yelling at me? He had been more physically violent on several ocassions several years ago, such as physically flinging me across the room, where I fell down, hit my head on a tile floor and passed out. He called my son in a panic who made him call 911. When the police and EMS came, I was still unconscious. But the woman cop, took him away from where my son and daughter in law were, and spoke to him in private. When I finally came to, they questioned me, I told the truth that I was putting him out and why, and was arrested because I scratched him on his shoulder as he began to throw me across the room. I spent 24 hours in jail. Thought I died and went to hell!!! Never did anything wrong in my entire life, not even a traffic ticket, and there I was in one room with at least 50 women who had prior jail records. He told the woman cop he wanted to leave the house and I tried to STOP HIM!!!! The truth was I was kicking him OUT!!!! But his calm and reasonable PERSONA won out and they believed him, despite me being unconscious when they arrived. When I was brought to the jail, another officer looked at my bruises and told me it sure looked like I WAS THE VICTIM OF DOMESTIC VIOLENCE!!!!! AND HE ALSO COULDN'T BELIEVE I WAS ARRESTED FOR A COUPLE OF SMALL SCRATCHES ON MY HUSBANDS SHOULDER. Of course, my lawyer had the case dismissed when I produced proof that he had voluntarily entered a 24 week program for Domestic Violence the year prior, but dropped out after attending only 4 sessions. WHAT A NIGHTMARE!!!! No one could believe the complete and total miscarriage of justice that took place that night. Since then, there's been no more physical violence, just the insane hair-trigger anger. We have no diagnosis for me to prove what I know. Since then, I have only ALLOWED HIM TO come back 2 more times and the minute I see his rage, I leave the room and when he calms down, I make him leave. In my case, the police are no option for me ever again!!!! No Contact is the only solution now. I'm in no position TO TAKE CHARGE, BETTY. But I thank you so very much for your kind and sincere advice.
Gina, it appears you are in a no win situation. I have no advice for you but want you to know we are here for you. Just try to take care of YOU. Keep yourself safe. Until he is DX you don't have much to work with. ((((HUGS))))))))))
TO LFL If I divorce him, and he dies, his company's policy is that ONLY THE SPOUSE will continue getting his checks. But through divorce, I am not the spouse any longer. So my finances are threatened no matter which way I turn. We've already divided the savings accounts....I took him off my car policy, but I know without divorce I am still in jeopardy. I just don't know what else to do. If you are correct in the stages he may be in, I know this could go on for years. But I don't think I will last that long!!!!! Your advice is so appreciated by me but I'm in a catch 22 situation. TO JANG....Thank you for your kind, kind words and support. TO AMBER...i forwarded them literature from this site a couple of years ago. Told them about my husband's father and older brother WHO HAD DISPLAYED THE SAME SYMPTOMS AT THE SAME AGE, but either it scares them or they just don't want to believe it. They think I'm the problem!!! because THEY ALWAYS SAY DADDY LOVES YOU, YOU'RE TOO SENSITIVE AND PARANOID. I am an only child and my parents are both dead. So Amber, I already tried what you so kindly suggested. and I thank you for trying to help.
I am alone......except for a few close friends who still live in New York, while I'm literally in HELL HERE IN ARIZONA. All I can do now is NO CONTACT and pray for the best outcome for ME now. And without a doubt, this wonderful site and all you kind and caring people are my only solace. Thanx to all of you for your help and advice. My love to you all, Gina
TO VICKIE....Thank you much for your very kind words. And you're right, I am in a no win situation. And until he does something more demonstrative in front of others, there is nothing I can do to get a DX or keep me, him or others safe. Thanx for the HUGS, I sure need them!!!!!!
Gina, if you file for divorce and your attorney files for a Qualified Domestic Relations Order (QDRO) you will be entitled to the spousal benefit to his pension even though you are no longer the spouse. This must be done with an attorney as part of the divorce proceeding. Check out the website www.dol.gov/ebsa/faqs/faq_qdro.html. Here's an excerpt from their site:
What is a Qualified Domestic Relations Order?
A "qualified domestic relation order" (QDRO) is a domestic relations order that creates or recognizes the existence of an alternate payee's right to receive, or assigns to an alternate payee the right to receive, all or a portion of the benefits payable with respect to a participant under a retirement plan, and that includes certain information and meets certain other requirements.
A domestic relations order is a judgment, decree, or order (including the approval of a property settlement) that is made pursuant to state domestic relations law (including community property law) and that relates to the provision of child support, alimony payments, or marital property rights for the benefit of a spouse, former spouse, child, or other dependent of a participant.
A state authority, generally a court, must actually issue a judgment, order, or decree or otherwise formally approve a property settlement agreement before it can be a domestic relations order under ERISA. The mere fact that a property settlement is agreed to and signed by the parties will not, in and of itself, cause the agreement to be a domestic relations order.
There is no requirement that both parties to a marital proceeding sign or otherwise endorse or approve an order. It is also not necessary that the retirement plan be brought into state court or made a party to a domestic relations proceeding for an order issued in that proceeding to be a domestic relations order or a qualified domestic relations order. Indeed, because state law is generally preempted to the extent that it relates to retirement plans, the Department takes the position that retirement plans cannot be joined as a party in a domestic relations proceeding pursuant to state law. Moreover, retirement plans are neither permitted nor required to follow the terms of domestic relations orders purporting to assign retirement benefits unless they are QDROs.
I am a retired Director of Human Resources and had to deal with QDRO's all the time when employees divorced their spouses. Since this is a federal law (ERISA) and if his employers pension plan is a plan under ERISA (which it most likely is) then you will qualify to receive spousal benefits under the QDRO provision if your attorney requests it as part of the divorce negotiations. Now if you don't want to get a divorce, then of course this doesn't apply, but there are provisions for you should you decide to go the divorce route. An initial consultation should be free or for minimal cost. Call the local/state bar association and get a referral to a family law attorney and see if you can get a pro-bono consultation. And take a copy the official pension plan document filed with ERISA so the attorney can advise you regarding what you would be entitled to if you divorce him.
Gina, I mean this with a lot of love and compassion because I too have been where you are. Unfortunately the cold hard truth is that only you can help you out of this catch 22 and this terrible situation. I know it's hard but you must start taking actions, however small, to help you towards a better life. Right now I see you have the following options: get him diagnosed (no matter how hard it is) and on the appropriate medications, consider divorce or leave things as they are. But to remain paralyzed where you currently are with no progress surely is the worst possible scenario. The first step is the hardest.
LFL has given you some excellent advice. However, you are the one who must ultimately make the decision and take the action. As she said, and I will reiterate it, you have 3 choices: 1. Remain in the situation (it will NEVER improve with Alzheimer's ) 2. Get him diagnosed so that he is on proper medications to control his behavior 3. Divorce him
TO LFL.....OMG, HOW DO I THANK YOU FOR THIS INVALUABLE INFORMATION????? Right now my head is spinning and just took 2 Tylenol to stop the pain in my head from all this. I am literally shaking after "trying" to comprehend all you informed me about. This month when I told him I wanted a divorce and I contacted his company Employee Benefits Dept. ...... No one there could tell me what happens with his pension in a divorce situation after his death. They said they would send me information but all I received was a sheet explaining the choices available when going on retirement. And the option we took showed it specified that the spouse would continue to receive the pension checks after death. How do I get a copy of the official pension plan document assuming it's filed with ERISA??????? How can I find out if it is in fact filed with ERISA.????? The Benefits Dept at his company is totally useless and have no knowledge or concern about any inquiries I have made this month. I know you recommend I go to a Family Law Attorney.....but why shouldn't I go straight to a divorce lawyer to handle this?????? Please help me understand that, LFL. This pension issue is the only thing right not stopping me from getting a divorce. If I could settle that, it would take a load off my mind. As a former travel agent, I have no pension of my own and will need his check if he dies before me. I hate to sound selfish but after a 45 year marriage, I need to start thinking about my welfare since no one else will. If you can help advise me regarding the 3 questions I just asked, it would mean so much to me. Again,my deepest gratitude to you and do believe you may just be my Guardian Angel!!!!!!!
Gina - I totally believe your story about a miscarriage of justice. I know my DH could fool anyone for a long time. But that was then, this is now and you do have a record of his being violent and dropping out of the Dom. Vio. program. You don't need a medical diagnosis to tell the police you are frightened and feel in danger. Just because it didn't work before is no reason to not try again. You say you are alone, no one will help, so that leaves only you to do something. How does NO Contact help? As LFL wrote, 'you remain paralyzed..surely the worst possible scenario.' Your actions sound more like the result of a lovers' quarrel instead of dealing with a brain disease.
If you won't go to the police, ask his doctor to help with this--invite him over for a romantic meal and get him skunk drunk, or get some knock out drops to put something in his water, whatever, then get him to the doctor where he can sleep it off and be examined. Yes, this is extreme, it's the nature of the disease that forces us to do such things. I repeat, you have the intact brain, he does not. You agreed to 'for worse' and 'in sickness.' You don't have to sacrifice yourself to those vows, but he needs help--who else is there?
But if you think No Contact is the best course, then so be it. I hope things work out for the best.
TO LULLIE......I live in South Chandler, right near Sun Lakes Retirement Community. Most people know where that is. Where do you live, Lullie??? It would be great to meet you!!!!! And any professional contacts you can provide would be a blessing. The 3 choices you listed are all obvious and awful. (1) To remain in this situation would be foolish. (2) He will NEVER agree to a DX!!!! (3) And if I can solve this pension issue, it just seems that Divorce is my only alternative. He's apparently doing fine enough living on his own right now so I don't feel guilty at all. In fact, I've suffered so much from him in the last few years, my health is being effected more and more. So, for me to take such a drastic step seems to be my only choice.
As I previously mentioned on your "discussion" I have been though the entire gamut of behavior problems and road blocks. LFL, and a few members remember the "crisis" issues I was facing less than a year ago. My husband is NOW (within the last year) being treated by a neurologist and psychiatrist. For too many years I lived a life very similar to what you describe. All the pain and agony could have been avoided with a proper medical diagnosis and mediations. My life is far from rosy, but his behavior is now more manageable.
TO BETTY...I appreciate your input, but to be honest, I can only see taking such extreme measures at this point can only cause more problems FOR ME. And in view of my fragile health right now and state of mind, I couldn't even entertain such extreme measures. No Contact IS NECESSARY WHEN IT applies to ANY toxic and dangerous relationship that has no solutions....and right now, that is the path I MUST FOLLOW. As for seeking help from his doctors, he has refused to see any of them for over 3 years. I know he needs help, but thus far, it seems that my 2 sons are in denial, or I would have had an intervention with them to pressure my husband to be tested. But, at this point, they would probably all give ME the intervention!!!!! So, for now I thank you for hoping things work out for the best. But there's nothing else I can do, unless LFL's suggestion works for a divorce.....In the interim, My Only alternative is No Contact.
I am so sorry you have this to deal with. I just do not understand how your sons don't believe how dangerous your husband is when he knocked you out. Please think out the best plan for yourself. And keep yourself safe. The no contact will work as long as your husband does not do anything to jeopardize your financial future. Stay strong and stay safe.
OK Gina, here goes. I'll answer your questions and provide more info that you should be aware of. Sorry my posts are so long, but I want you to get reliable information that will help you make the best decision(s) for you and your situation. I'll start with the easiest question first.
1) Why contact a Family Law attorney rather than a divorce attorney? A family law attorney is usually a divorce attorney-just a different name. So contact a GOOD divorce attorney to discuss your options. Be prepared with questions to ask and documents to share with him (bring enough copies of the documents, e.g. pension plan, for you, him/her and an extra). Make sure to take notes regarding his specific advice. This is important.
2) How do I get a copy of the official pension plan documents? By law (ERISA- EMPLOYEE RETIREMENT INCOME SECURITY ACT) all participants in the company pension plan (your husband is a participant based on the info you provided) are required to receive a copy of the pension plan documents if the pan is an ERISA qualified plan. Typically the benefits department will send the plan participant a copy of the summary plan description (SPD) which highlights the plan provisions in plain English or provide a company website which has the document available for plan participants to access. This document will have many of the major provisions documented but it is NOT the official pension plan document. The SPD should have information regarding what happens under a QDRO. It should also have either in the beginning or end that the plan is filed as an ERISA plan and have the full plan registration number under the ERISA law. Your husband should have been provided a copy of the SPD at some point in his career with the copy and most likely at the time of his election to retire. If you cannot find a copy of the SPD, you have to contact the Company and request another copy. You should call/contact the benefits department and ask who to speak to (probably the Pension Plan Manager) in order to receive the SPD and the official plan document filed with ERISA. If the person who answers does not know to whom to direct you (they should be able to) ask to speak to either the Director of Benefits Plans or the VP of HR. Keep escalating until you get someone who can help you. BE SURE TO TAKE NOTES WHILE ASKING FOR HELP. Document the date/time of the call, the names of the people you speak to (ask them to spell their names so you get the correct spelling) and a brief summary of the information they give you and any commitments they make (when they will send the booklet, etc) and their direct telephone number.
3) How do I know if the pension plan is an ERISA plan? See above. Make sure when you're calling you ask for a copy of the official pension plan in addition to the SPD.
If you don't get satisfactory responses, put a call into the company's CEO office and tell them you have an inquiry/complaint. I used to be the designated person to respond to all employee/retiree inquiries/complaints to the CEO for a Fortune 100 company. Most large companies have someone designated to respond to employees/retires. If that doesn't work, have your attorney contact the firm and request the appropriate documents on your behalf.
You should really consult a divorce attorney, ask him/her about community property laws and if you'll be subject to them. If so, all of the assets you and your husband have will be spit in half (possibly any assets you received soley for you). The individual state laws differ so a divorce attorney will be able to advise you. I am not an attorney and cannot advise you but I can help you learn how to get information that will be helpful.
Also, based on the length of your marriage you may also be entitled to half of your husband's social security while he's still alive (if you're not already collecting it) and a portion of his ss after he dies, even if you divorce him. The divorce attorney can help you with that if you need it.
Gina, good luck and I dearly hope you will take some first steps, whatever direction you choose.
TO BLUE.....Thank you so much, Blue, for your kind words. I do believe I can keep my sanity as long as I keep No Contact. As for my financial future, I know I have to do something to ensure that. I promise I will stay strong, as soon as I get there. That's the problem right now. He called today to see if I needed him for anything around the house. I was shaking and just said ....I can't deal with this but thanx for asking. Been a wreck ever since the call. I told him I don't want to see him anymore just several days ago. Either forgot it, even though I also wrote it in an email....and never said that to him before.....or he was in his caring mood ....or he wanted to torture me some more. Go figure. Jekyll and Hyde, but lately more Hyde than Jekyll. I'm sorry I even answered the phone today, but didn't have my glasses on and just picked up. Won't do that again!!!
gina - in the meantime what about a legal separation? That is what my DIL got from my son. We live in a community property state but because of the legal separation where all his debt she is not responsible, she is also not responsible if he should get in an accident in his vehicle.
TO CHARLOTTE......That is something I never knew, or even thought about, Charlotte. I definitely think that is something I need to explore. Thank you ever so much for your helpful and thoughtful suggestion. That would be a great solution for me rather than going for a divorce and worry about the pension stuff. I so appreciate your input to try to help me find a workable solution. And I think emotionally I would feel much better than actually divorcing a man I have loved for the last 47 years. Again, thank you.
with all you have said Gina, you should make an apt with a divorce atty and have a sitdown and get answers. after that information they provide it will be easier to plan out your strategy. I would not advise further contact with your spouse under any circumstances. a legal separation may be a good way to proceed here to avoid a lot of liability and also a way to see you have more protection. you can also have your atty place a restraining order on him with his previous assaults and documentations. your safety is primary here and all else will fall into place with the info you receive from a qualified attorney. its not easy but in this situation when you have a spouse in denial who is dangerous and violent and no recourse to medications, its a real no win situation and one must make very difficult decisions. wishing you the best of luck. divvi
I too have been married for over 40 yrs. and yes I know all about the personality changes, I kept taking my dh to doctors until they started I'm on meds. Do whatever you have to do. He needs to be on meds. Talk with the nurse before hand, pass him notes, do whatever it takes. Please don't leave your spouse of 42 yrs to deal with this alone. He needs you desperately. We have all gone thru these periods when first Dx'd Yes, I've heard many times it was all me. Yes I've even contemplated divorce before I found out the problem. Do what you have to do to get help. I have. Sneaked nerve meds in my dh s drinks .
TO DIVVI....You are so right in saying once I consult a divorce attorney regarding separation, I will then have the information I'll need to plan my next move. Right now I just feel so overwhelmed and devastated. Don't even trust myself to drive since I finally made up my find to stop this on and off insanity just this week. I always held out hope that things could work out, but this week I finally admitted to myself that I was just sticking my head in the sand and have to walk away. That acknowledgement of reality , in my mind finally, has me now spinning. I tried to go driving for food shopping yesterday, and I had to come right back home because my head was shaking so uncontrollably and the road appeared to be bounching up and down. Never ever experienced that before!!!! I think the last 4 horrible years has finally caught up with me. It's as if it's all hitting me now that I decided and admitted to myself tht it was hopeless. No more hope, no more Tony, no more happiness. But thank you very much, Divvi, for your advice and best wishes. I do appreciate it.
TO KY CAREGIVER......Perhaps you haven't read the whole story but my husband just refuses to go to any of his doctors at all, including the cardiologist, pulmonary specialist, his GP. For the last 3 years, he has refused to go for specific tests he NEEDS for his heart and lungs, whereas, before, he went religiously go for them every year. There is no reasoning with him and I've just stopped trying. If I can't get him to deal with his normal medical problems anymore, which he KNOWS he has, it is just impossible to get him to have his brain checked.You were so lucky your dh was compliant and agreed to go to the doctors. I had begged my husband to go, explaining that they have meds today that can help eliminate his new hair-trigger temper. As far as he's concerned, there's nothing wrong with him. And that's that. Boy I wish I would have tried sneaking xanax in his food while I had the chance. Your comment about that brought a smile to my face. But thank you so much for offering good advice, which just won't work on my stubborn dh. And most of all, making me smile was a true gift for me!!!!
dear Gina. its sounding as if you are experiencing panic or anxiety attacks friend. maybe you can see your own dr about this and get yourself under control first. after you tackle this overwhelming sensation of loss and confusion, then you can make that apt with the atty to iron out plans. first things first. if you aren not in a good place physically and mentally then it will be futile to proceed with all these very difficult moves and decisions. please take care of yourself first. admitting the problems are always a good step forward. remember a thousand mile journey always starts with that first step. ps and when you see your own dr be sure to relay all your concerns over your husbands violent episodes. having that documented in your own files and why you need some anti anxiety meds may come in handy in the future having that documented. divvi
ATTENTION; LULLIE I've been trying to see if there is a way for us to communicate privately. Feel so bad taking up all the posting space on this thread alone. I was so happy to hear you live here in Arizona....probably about an hour from Chandler, I think. But I'm not too savy on this site, or any site, for that matter. What do some of the people here do if they want to private message each other??? Also, at some point it would be wonderful to actually meet together. If you or anyone else has a suggestion for private communication, please advise how I could go about it.
Are you a member of "Facebook"? If you are you can contact me though Charlotte. I only recently became a member and connect with some of the "peeps" from this site. Other than that...I am clueless. Perhaps Charlotte will come along to help.
I would like to meet with you also.
Hope that you get things resolved for you both you and your husband's benefit soon. This disease is a monster.....it has no mercy :(
Gina, I SO understand about your DH not going to the doctor. My DH HATED going to the doctor. He hadn't gone for decades & then finally realized that he had high blood pressure. He went to our family doctor & then had to go every 4 months to get blood work to monitor his high blood pressure, cholesterol & pre diabetes. He was needle phobic, so when I reminded him of his appointments he would get upset with ME & he was rude to person taking his blood. When I started to see the changes in him & finally convinced our doctor that there was something wrong he told my DH that he should go see a neurologist. Well he flatly refused & as you know when that happens there is NOTHING that you can do or say that will make them go. Our children finally stepped in & had an intervention talk with him & he finally consented to go (of course he told them that I was making this all up & it was my fault, but of course they could see the changes in him too). I'm convinced that if our children wouldn't have confronted him I don't think he would have EVER gone to the neurologist. I agree with all the legal advice you have been given here, but I just wanted you to know that I DO know exactly what you are going through & my heart goes out to you. (((HUGS)))
TO DIVVI.....PANIC ATTACKS.....IS THAT WHAT IT IS??? I thought I was getting Parkinsons Disease!!!!! Sure hope you're right and it has helped relieve my mind in that area. Since I never experienced that before I will tell my doctor about the shaking head and hands, who already knows about the trouble with my dh. It just seems that with every hurdle I try to resolve, another one pops up. I just don't know which one to tackle but your're right about me first dealing with new phyical manifestation. Thanx so much Divvi. TO VICKIE....Duh....I didn't even remember I had shown my email address, it was about 2 years ago and I had completely forgotten about it. Thanx for the heads up. TO ELAINE....DH used to always go every year for his heart tests, due to a heart stent he had....and every year for his lung tests, due to a growth there....So these last 3 years are a new change in his thinking impairment. I wish my 2 sons believed all I tell them, because I did think of having an intervention but that's out of the question until they finally see what I see and know. When they do see him, it's only once in a while and the visit lasts only a few hours. And he seems normal as all hell. I too believe the intervention would have worked but I can't struggle anymore to convince them and they only thing I'm paranoid. I just give up. But thanx so much for your kind message and wise input. TO.....LULLIE Looking forward to hearing from you.
I still don't understand how your sons think you are paranoid when you were left unconscious by your husband. Surly they understand that he is dangerous. And is not safe to be around.
Gina, I think it will be very valuable for you and Lulliebird to connect...when she first joined this site she was experiencing some very similar feelings that you're having now and I believe she would be a great person to help you begin to move forward. She has made remarkable progress in dealing with her own feelings and accepting her role as caregiver and handing her husband's challenging behaviors.
I went back and read all your posts in 2011 My observation after reading the 2011 posts and the current ones is that you are having a very difficult time coming to terms with your husband's illness and the overwhelming emotional upheaval you're experiencing back then and now is immobilizing you from taking some very constructive 1st steps which would help both of you. I don't want to offend you but if you read all the advice given in 2011 and 2013 you always find a reason why the advice given is impossible to implement.
All of us here have been through much of what you're experiencing. We have compassion and concern for you and really want to help you by sharing our own experiences and what has helped/worked for us. But in order for us to help you, you have to be willing to accept our help.
TO LFL.....I wanted to back and read all my posts from 2011, because at that time I really didn't know if he really had the illness or just really wanted OUT. I thought I was devastated THEN, but since THEN.....I have now accepted this horrible fact and have gone through such terrible periods since then, that I am now READY to do what I need to do. You didn't offend me in the least, LFL. I know I wasn't accepting what was going on then. And I guess, I still had hope that all would get back to normal or he would leave me for another woman. But since then, with all that's happened since, I have come to the conclusion that he really is ill.How do I read my old posts? I appreciate your comments about how I am EVEN NOW, still trying to find reasons to NOT implement advice given. I don't want to do that but you are correct in saying I am immobilized. I've only admitted to myself the complete truth of my situation last week, and that realization is shaking me to the core. And with no support from my 2 sons, I am petrified to do ALMOST ANYTHING ON MY OWN. I was an only child of 2 Italian loving parents who hovered over me all my life. I went from them to my husband, who did the same for me. Being alone now, has me frightened to death. I am intelligent, very successful in my profession when I worked, and everyone always came to ME for advice in their lives. It literally kills me that I am being so weak and pathetic right now!!!! Please don't give up on me, I'm trying the best I possible can right now. Am I wrong now doing No Contact?? Next month I am going for further testing for a lump in my neck and also the 3rd test for multiple cysts in my kidnies, and a follow up colonoscopy for polyps, which I have a history of. On top of that, since I am turning 65 in October, I am losing my good medical insurance and will now be stuck on Medicare....meaning more financial stress with all my current medical problems. And I'm also a Type 2 Diabetic, who has successfully controlled it for 9 years by diet alone....no meds whatsoever. My doctor said tht I am the only patient he ever had do that and succeed. So please know I'm not a total coward or a person who has not lived her life just running and scared. My real self is in there somewhere....I just need to survive her and bring her back to life. I do thank you for your honesty as you see it, and I am intelligent enough to know you are correct. BUT I AM TRYING SO VERY VERY HARD!!!!!
Gina, I am so glad you didn't take what I said the wrong way...I was worried you would and that you would feel unsupported. And that was not my intention. Actually I and the others here want very much to support you through this very difficult phase and help you get more control over this very devastating reality you are now living. You are not alone, you have us.
Go to the search tab and put in the word newbie....then look for your posts under the topic headings (you initiated them). That will give you most of the comments and advice you had from 2011.
Try to contact Lullie, I really believe she can be a very big assistance to you and help you take that first step.