Up until a couple of days ago, I thought I had become pretty much immune to the way DH's family has acted toward him. Their behavior has varied from ignoring us for months or years at a time, to being very rude and thoughtless when they are around us. (One brother actually told DH that it must be nice to not have to get up and go to work every day—like having a terminal disease was a small price to pay for getting to retire early.) Only one sibling even sends us a Christmas card now, and it's a big family. As DH has said several times, it must be that to them he's already dead.
This week I found out that they had surpassed even their own record for thoughtlessness. DH's father was recently placed in a nursing home, and prior to that, all his property was divided up among the siblings. Oh, except for my husband, of course. There was no inquiry if there was anything he would like to have, even for a keepsake. And, of course, there was no reason for anything of value to go to my husband, because he's just going to die, anyway. (Meanwhile, I'm having a constant struggle to keep the wolf from the door.) I am just struck dumb by such actions by "family". The family member who gave me this news didn't even seem to think that I would have a problem with their actions. It was just casual conversation to them.
As though dealing with this disease was not hard enough, I have the additional burden of dealing with this lovely bunch of relatives. I really think it's time to stop calling them "family" after this. But how do I manage to interact with them at all now? Seriously, if I ever see any of them in person again, I'm afraid I'll wind up being featured on the 6:00 news in a segment that starts with "Crazed caregiver….."
What really, really scares me is that, since we have no children, these siblings are the people we had named as backup caregiver if something happened to me. I can imagine how much "care" DH would receive. They'd probably clean out our house and little bank account, dump DH in the nearest nursing home, and disappear forever.
JanK--The only thing you didn't mention, that I have experienced, is interfering by DH's family in his care. The latest was actually smuggling him cigarettes while in the hospital. They are in denial, don't want tobelieve what they actually see txhemselves and believe me responsible for hiscondition, the meds, everything.
One idea crossed my mind--would it be worth checking with a Lawyer about the disbursement of his father's property? Surely, that should have been governed in someway as it was his estate.
We have one Daughter. I just placed DH. Our house is for sale and I just moved. She claimed all she wanted that I did not need or want. She'll get what I have later.
As to his family, sad but true, my contact is continuing to shrink. DD and I have tenative funeral plans roughed out. When I pointed out to her that our plans--what we can afford--are not much like what his family does, and asked her how she felt about that, her response was, "They can KMA."
I won't miss them when there will no longer be need for contact. Sad.
aww janK yes its unfortunate but true how so called 'family' can be so uncaring with regards to our AD spouses. for myself, like you i will go on and really dont think i will feel much pain of losing contact in the end, but for the memory of DH as well like yours we wish that they could show a bit more caring and respect to the person they were and are. sometimes i believe the only communicative actions will be when we announce they have passed. and everyone will breath a sigh of relieve except those who really cared. i have been caring for 12+yrs here basically alone during this time and my DH family (including kids specifically have yet to offer a few hrs respite for me, to sit with dad while i got out-they may stop by maybe 2-3times per year for a short visit at best. if i get out its by a paid worker, which seems to me more caring at heart. and again like you i believe all our family members and friends who deny love and forming attachments during these cruel years see them as 'already dead' as you stated. just so sad for us all. its also unfortunate that these are also the backup caregivers. more than likely our spouses would be placed as none would want the added burdens ps if his deceased dads estate had any worth to it, ie a home to sell or furnishings, and a 'will' then you should request a copy asap. it would outline who would inherit what. by no means can they just 'decide' that your spouse because he is ill, doesnt get a say or inherits. it goes to him, via you and or your kids, if you are his DPOA.
Could an elder lawyer step in here to cancel the siblings back up-care proviso and set up a legal guardian, even if it's State? Talking through my hat here, as I don't know how it works in America. I do know that by getting Co-committeeship from the Supreme Court of B.C., we were accountable to the Public Guardian trustee, and if I had died before my husband did, PGT would have had some say, along with the Co-committee, re. my husband's care. (They would probably have continued on with the care plan and Facility he was already in.) His children would not have a say: they had already demonstrated to the courts their unsuitability.
Jan, We went to an ELA a few years ago and we did the DPOA and our wills. My will has a "Special Needs Trust" set up for my DH if I should die first. We don't have any children and no family to take care of anything so we have a "surrogate" (can't think of the term right now). He will manage the money etc. for my DH and make sure he is taken care of. You might be able to do this and leave his realtives out of any decision making.
I'LL go back and read the others ideas but my first thought is get with your eldercare attorney NOW...If it were me, I would have your lawyer help you find a way to have follow on caregiving personnel on deck should anything happen to you. Next check on who has POA for you should you be unable to do that task...illness etc. If any of them are on that list change that..they will steal from you because they think what belongs to your husband belongs to them anyway...don't let them in your house ever. Meet elsewhere. My husband's elderly aunt had relatives on her side that stole things from under her nose as though she wouldn't notice but she did and so did we and we could not get anything back for her. Who knew who took what?? Make sure none of his relatives are on any documents of financial nature...and frankly if your husband had a notion to disinherit any of them do that now while he can make that decision. Remember them only with one dollar! He is hurt by the things he has said..he is aware of their aloofness. They deserve nothing from him but you can be sure if he were to pass away this group of vultures would descend upon your home in a nanosecond " to pay respects" and take whatever they think " he would want them to have". I have seen that happen! Once you have taken care of business..cut them out of your life...I have had to do that in the past just to have my own peace of mind...( for other reasons) and since your spouse means so little to them...show them in return they mean nothing to you now. You deserve peace of mind and not to worry a thing about them...and frankly I am just mean enough that with people like this, something my aunt did too when her spouse died of ALZ, she announced his death only to those who remained in their lives and his funeral was by invitation only. He had once been the CEO of Sunkist! So he knew a lot of people and they dropped him like a bad habit when his illness was DXed...there was an article in the paper but Invitation only and at the cemetery the personnel there had a list of names and only those on the list were admitted. She got her point across too!
I suspect Jan meant the personal belongings. They are rarely covered in a will and 'the family' probably got together to divide that up. Their behaviour is atrocious because they had an obligation to include him even if they decided on what he got and as she said some pieces would have been sentimental or valuable.
When we get treated like this it cuts deep and I would consider emailing them or communicating in some way that they have hurt their brother by ignoring his existence in such an important event in his life. The DH clearly didn't have the ability to fend for himself here or he would have and my thoughts, given that they have behaved like this, is to set the tone that I would be most comfortable with. Which includes telling them directly that this has affected the relationship.
If I'm Jan I already know this bunch thinks like this. It's very hurtful; but, what can you do? Complain and set the tone for the future. If I'm a conflict avoider my life just got harder because you can say what you like but nobody forgives this kind of stuff easily. So now I have to pretend like it's ok. Not great.
I either let them go emotionally (that is start to do that) and take any help that might come my way and pretend - or I tell them to take a hike now knowing I'm better off not having to pretend. Tough call. Pick the one you can most easily live with.
Here's a possible rough draft:
Dear Poopheads,
I have a gun. Lately I've been having strange thoughts about avenging the wrong we see in the world. Thank goodness family always sticks together and would never do horrid things like treat their brother as though he's dead already.
Jan, how horrible! So sorry for you and your DH. Was so sad to hear he said they must already think him dead. I can’t understand how people can be so heartless and cruel. I can’t help but think of vultures… the father is in a nursing home, not dead, why are they dispersing his belongings and funds now?
Maybe you could write them a letter? It is often healing to get your feelings out in the open. And so you don’t end up on the TV show Snapped, (wink) it might be better to do it in a letter instead of in person. Also, that way you can let them all know at once and not have to emotionally drain yourself saying it over and over.
Dear Jan I read your post and I can relate partly to what you say and the best advice I can give you is this: When you and your husband married you married and made vows to him and him alone. You did not marry his family. What they are doing is almost unbelievable but thankfully your husband is probably unaware of how they are acting. At least I would hope so. If not then just stick with him and try not to let his so-called family get to you. You are not responsible for their actions and probably will never understand their selfishness. It is really sad how sometimes siblings feud over their parents belongings many times even before they are gone. Rest assured our all-knowing God sees this behavior and He will individually judge them someday. Forgiving them for their actions even though it is hard, will bring you peace of mind and God will reward you for it and bless you in the long run. God be with you and your husband. Bruce D *
Wolf, love the little note. divvi, Lloyd has 3 kids and I have 3 kids. His 3 rarely come or call. Thank God Lloyd has reached a point that they can no longer be on his mind. His youngest (32) dropped by about 6 months ago and he did not know who she was. She stood in the drive, cried, left, and never came back. Bye bye!!! His oldest (40) has blamed every bad thing that has ever happened in her life on Lloyd. I told her to grow up and assume some responsibility...and never come back. I relented when he ended up in ICU in April 2010. We are now back to no contact. His son Lloyd Jr. makes contact when he feels like it. It's ok because my 3 kids adore him and are right here to help. My youngest rented her house and move back home so I could quit work and take care of him. Her husband added a third story to my house to make room at cost. His dad did heating/cooling/electrical all for free. It has been wonderful having Maria, Brett, and the 2 grandsons (17 &18) here to help. I saw our lawyer after our ICU visit. At that time his will was modified, I got POA, and we both got DNR's. His will states that my youngest daughter inherits everything and she keeps Lloyd and makes decisions in his best interest. No more nightmares about me dying, his kids getting him and locking him in a room somewhere and spending all his money on their good times. I get peace from knowing that everything that goes around comes around and I don't have to be any part of it.
Linda Mc--if possible, you may want to get a note from your husband's doctor that he was mentally competent as of the date the will was modified (if this was after dementia dx.) It may help if his children challenge the will.
very true marilyn. even so if the kids are cut out completely then a challenge will probably occur unless he left them a dollar or so in the will. usually an atty will suggest this to show the spouse acknowledges the kids but chose to leave them 'something' and acknowledges they are being denied the bulk of inheritance for reasons known to him . otherwise like you say AFTER its documented any form of dementia could be a motive for challenges to changes. its for this reason i chose to leave the will as was. i agree that although my DH kids have not stepped up to honor and visit, they are his kids. and even though they were not as devoted as we would like in sickness OR before, he chose to include them in his final testament. i would not change that regardless how i feel about them at this point. its opening a can of worms to make changes after mental status is of concerns. i would hope that you would have at mimimum 2 competent witnesses that know the individual and can back up the mental status as witnesses as well as having it notorized just in case. this should have been done at the time of changes. doing it later may not be as good if any but i am no atty nor any trying to give legal advice, one should always consult with a legal professional to get things right.
I just lost a big post, so will I will summarize it to say: Marilyn and Divvi have raised important issues, and I hope you will avoid probable further problems with the step kids by addressing it now with the best lawyer you can get. In my view,it's a given that they are going to come after you after his death, and you will be faced with big legal bills and lose. In Canada, his children would have the legal right to inherit half of his wealth (property and money), and you the other half. It's better to be generous, as Divvi is, and avoid problems, than to put yourself under that stress. "His will states that my youngest daughter inherits everything and she keeps Lloyd and makes decisions in his best interest. No more nightmares about me dying, his kids getting him and locking him in a room somewhere and spending all his money on their good times." It's good that your daughter will have this power to protect him, and that is the most important part of his will.
My lo has no children but doted on her nieces and nephews. She was very close to her brothers and sister-in-laws. We spent most holidays with her family. One sister-in-law came to visit and she did call a few times but no one else saw her in almost a year (no brothers). I asked them in Dec. 2010 if they would come help organize the basement while she could tell them what was there and what she wanted to do. They didn't email to say they were coming until 6 months later. I told them we had already hired a handyman to help us and that she wouldn't remember now. When they came to visit, finally, after Christmas, they went snooping in the basment. Her brother came up and asked if he could take the videos. I was fine with him taking those. Then he asked about other things. I gladly gave them the boxes of books that had a nephews name on them. A sister-in-law asked about "grandma's table" and I just looked at her and said sorry, it's in the will to go to someone else, which it is. In her will there is something for each niece and nephew. My lawyer told me that I can sell anything of hers now especially if I'm using the money for her care ....like her mother's diamond rings (for one niece), the table (for a different nephew), etc. I'm thinking about it. Part of me says do it and the other part says that's just not me, don't do it. I will not ever see any of her family when this is over.
I have 80+ y/o parents (who ARE helping with care) We have no children. She has 4 brothers who are thousands of miles away and we have visited only 4 times in 20+ years.
After Dx we went back to the brothers and asked who would 'want' to take her if I died. They are very nice people and all had big hearts, but they got their own kids, lives and financial problems. So, after returning home our ELA drew up papers that named a Professional Conservator. This person is named in the papers but does not get paid unless she needs to step in and manage the wife's situaion. She has a full compliment of clients she manages now. AD folks but developmentally disabled children too.
Before the attorney I never knew professional conservators existed.
When we bought this house, Lloyd had his original will made out and he omitted the kids by name. That was 14 years ago and there were no signs of AD then. At the time, I asked the lawyer if he could exclude them like that and he said yes. I have the original will as well as the modified one.
We had our wills done up and he has in his that he doesn't want anything to go to his kids because they severed contact with him over 15 years ago and they are not in financial need.
Is this enough or do I need something different. This has been on my mind as to whether I am protected or not. if so who would you recommend. I maybe going through what you went through in the future.
I can't understand how family are so distance now. It's like if it not in my house then it's not my concern.
FYI - When I went to our Elder Law and Estate attorney I asked about other interesting stories from the world of probate. She told me that her partner was having to endure a 2 year fight to probate a will that had been written in the 70s. It seems the law changed and made it technicaly obsolete. Something about witnesses, the judged refused to accept it. Lesson - If you have an "old" will AND you have specific reqests maybe a talk with a lawyer to verify that it is indeed current might be in order.
I would recommend Helen Low, expensive, but absolutely the best. hlow@fasken.com work (604) 631-3223 Helen Low Fasken Martineau DuMoulin LLP Barristers and Soliciters 2900 - 550 Burrard Street Vancouver, B.C. V6C 0A3 Fax (604) 631 - 3232 I'd put a summary in an e-mail to her and ask her if she would advise. Perhaps a lawyer in your area? Or does she think it necessary to see you? You can say I recommended her, and you can stay here is you need to come into town.
Less than 90 days after my DH passed away, I received a certified letter from his son demanding a $300,000 insurance policy or the equivalent in cash, that he had promised their mother when they were divorced in 1982. That insurance policy was owned by his company and was not part of his retirement package. I replied that there was no such policy, they did not believe me and hired an attorney (or said they did). I had to turn to my attorney for advice and long story short, it cost me almost $15,000 to defend what was true. (They also referred to a one million dollar trust fund that he supposedly told them he had in an "offshore account" for them.) Talk about confabulation!!! I only wish he HAD a million dollars somewhere.. but that was totally untrue. We had a iron-clad will, nothing was left to them., and in Texas, the homestead is automatically passed to the spouse along with other specified items, that do not go through his 'estate' after Probate.
I have NEVER heard a single word from them -- after his memorial service, -- until today. My attorney warned them to stop sending me the letters and asked that they only communicate to me through HER. They were a nightmare before he died and worse after he died. What's so crazy is that the son is a retired AF Colonel who flies for American airlines and makes over $200,000 a year with them.. PLUS his retirement... and his daughters are extremely well to do. They did not need that money, (even if it did exist).
I rarely post anymore on this site, as I've moved on in my life, but I read your letters and so often I just need to step in and add some advice.
The word HERE is (1) do NOT expect step children to help YOU... and (2) Be very diligent about having all your paperwork in order..do not TRUST them to do the 'right' thing.
I had a feeling that they would pull a trick like that, and everyone else, including my own children, thought I was paranoid. I was right, all along. Trust your instincts. Think smart. Keep your guard up.
A little paranoia can be a good thing, Nancy B, as we both found out. "Hope for the best. Prepare for the worst. Be reasonable. Follow-through."(Robert Schuller). Those were the days, weren't they? I'm almost through them now and can breathe again. Good to hear from you, as always. Thanks for sharing your experience with Amber, who is also from B.C. but north of Vancouver.
Mary and Nancy- Thank you for the info. I couldn't find an "elder lawyer" when I goggled for bc. I will definately call her and see if there is someone she recommends in Kamloops. If not I would enjoy meeting and staying with you.
Even though I have done everything the Alz society recommended I am still worried. I don't have lots but I've worked hard and own it all and I'll be damned if I will give to any one of them that haven't been around for years.
Amber, I sent you an e-mail, but am not sure I sent it to the right Amber. Anyway,in it it I said that Helen has recommended two lawyers to me, and they were both excellent. One was for the recent car accident I was in - rear-ended and car totaled - the other for a property issue on the Sunshine Coast. The one on the Sunshine Coast also happened to specialize in elder law but had a general practice. I think you're wise to take care of business now. You don't need any problems down the road. Best of luck.
Yes..All of you who have children and/or step children should see an Elder Attorney and have all your finances, property, etc. fixed to the wishes of you and your spouse. Some of you here may recall about two years ago when my dh's son was attempting a plot to come from Ill. to Ca. to get him and take him back to Ill. He contacted my dh when I wasn't here and said he was flying to Ca. and would take him back to Ill. At that time, my dh could understand a lot more then he can now and he also could remember much better.
I had gone to church and the son called his dad while I was gone. My dh told me about the call as soon as I got home from church and wanted my opinion. I then called his son. The son explained he was going to fly to Ca. and get his dad and take him back to Illinois for a fishing vacation. I asked him how his dad was going to get back to Ca? He said he would put him on a plane to fly back. Then...I said why would you fly here to get him if you think he is well enough to fly back alone...why not just let him fly to Illinois by himself. The son...had no answer to that...The son got real huffy with me and called me all types of names and said his dad had told him he was unhappy here and wanted to come back to Illinois. Needless to say...I said no way was that ever going to happen. Of course, he also spilled the beans that he wanted power-of-attorney over his dad...and I said... No way was that ever going to happen either and he just better get a grip over how sick his dad really was and if he wanted to see him he should come to Ca. Of course that has never happened.
The next day I made an appt. with an Elder Attorney and was thrilled with the way he set up trusts so that my dh is protected and so am I from anyone getting anything until WE both are dead. He set up a trust that I am in charge of for the care of my dh....if I die first another trustee takes over the trust for my dh's care until he dies. Also, my dh was so mad about what his son tried to do when he fully understood the situation that he has left both his sons only $500 each. They will be floored by this and I am glad.
The main thing is that this was done when my dh could understand what was happening to the extent the attorney felt comfortable in doing the trusts and wills the way he did. So...please don't wait too long to take care of these financial problems that might happen.
JanK: I can't relate exactly to what you are going thru, so I just send you my understanding and best wishes. I do understand how other people can hurt us and it looks to me like you have some of the best (or worst).
When I worked in the bank, a dear lady came in to see us. She was a second wife and she had nursed her husband through Alzheimer's with no help or visits from HIS daughter. After he died and left everything to his wife, dear daughter contested the will and insisted that her father had not been of sound mind when he did the will. She also claimed that the signature on his will was forged. The poor lady was in the bank to have us search for any signed documents done prior to the will. She was hoping it would prove that the signature on the will was not forged. I felt so sorry for her and so indignant that a daughter would not pay any attention to an ill father. That was several years before I knew about Gord.
Set up a trust. Kids won't have any access to it. It's not a public document.
They can try to contest - people can sue for anything - but if you have a good attorney, she/he will make sure everything is done correctly and there is no question about the validity of a signature or the state of mind the person was in.