I don't remember seeing this discussed. In fact, it was just a few weeks ago when I even knew there was this terminology. I googled it and feel this is what is happening to my DH. A few days ago it feels as if we jumped off a cliff and I don't know if we will be climbing out of this situation. Lucky for us we have a connection with the Urgent Care facility where we are and I plan to take him back today since I am not sure how to proceed. Geriatric failure to thrive just seems to be the coming together of everything physical. For my DH this is AD and PD and now apparently constipation and anemia. I have pushed so many fluids I've made him gain three pounds - with little luck in the elimination. Now he keeps saying, "I don't know what to do" over and over. When he woke me up at 3 AM to say that I had a very good answer - "go to sleep" but got up and made a cup of tea and that helped. Right now he is breathing as if he can't get enough oxygen, but I don't think that is it. The big blessing is that he sleeps almost 20 hours a day, which gives me time to be prepared for when he is awake. I have a feeling we will be staying in Bozeman longer than planned....
I have no experience with any of this, thank God. We have discussed it, but it is buried in a thread labeled something else. There are people here who have experienced failure to thrive.
However, you have to take him to the doctor and he may need to go into the hospital. I think you are right that he has several systems failing. It might be the end result of dementia, or it might be something they can fix. If he isn't eliminating the fluids you need to stop pushing them. I know that several times when I was in the hospital in the past they were counting both the intake and the outgo on me to make sure they pretty much matched. From what you are saying his don't. And that worries me a lot.
The anemia might just be from pushing fluids. Or it might be a symptom of something else. Is there an Emergency room where you are? Because if there is I'd be a lot happier with you going there than to the Urgent Care center no matter how good they are.
Because of weird insurance when I lived in California, I don't head to Emergency as quickly as I ought to. I've actually been sent there by my current doctor when I spoke to her over the phone. Because my medical group in California ran an Urgent Care center you weren't allowed to go to Emergency unless the paramedics took you there, which is how I ended up going unconscious at one morning even though I'd been to the Urgent Care the night before. So I understand going to the Urgent Care first. And the one you are using sounds especially competent.
The thing is that in that buried thread, it was obvious that Failure to Thrive was more of a long term problem, while you seem to be dealing with an emergency situation.
Take care of yourself, and your LO. I'm really worried about both of you.
Frand; I hear the concern in your words... I'll be hoping that this is just a little bump in the road for you and your DH. Please seek medical help soon and keep us posted. I'll be thinking of you and sending good thoughts your way.
Starling and Anita41 - Thanks for responding. We are going back to Urgent Care at 10 when it opens, since I know I am in over my head. I'll post when I know more. Frankly, I can't imagine how my DH would fail if he was in a hospital situation. I'd like to avoid that if possible.
Jane,I don't know, but believe me, I have been wondering about that. I have been thinking he is late stage 4 or early 5, but what is happening now seems like a big change. I'm guessing we all dream about getting help - even if that means being ready for Hospice.
Frand, inability to breath well, ascites, or retention of fluids esp in the legs or abdomen, issues with bowels can be signs of issues with the heart, i have lots of heart issues in our family and we are well versed on the signs. you need to get him for a thorough evaluation to be sure. its past the point of general constipation i think. let us know, good luck! divvi
ps. then you are also right it could be infection like bladder or kidney but the dr where you took him should run some blood/urine tests to see if its infection and treat accordingly. both of these make them very sick and weak and sleepy alot. the kidney would be more serious and needs to be attended to as it can lead to sepsis which is life threatening. been there done that one too, didnt see the signs early enough in DH late one nite and by morning he was sick enough to be admitted to hospital for 3 days for kidney and sepsis. again, my best wishes for a speedy recovery i hope its not anything too serious =divvi
I think geriatic failure to thrive is the one where they (along with other things) just lose weight and go downhill, and it's not due to a condition that can be helped. My LO is losing weight at an incredible weight, and she eats fine. It's just the body shutting down. We're at 74 lbs now, and there doesn't seem to be any reason other than the AD forgetting to tell the body to process the food.
Yep...it's one of the ways to get an AD patient on. It's harder to get an AD patient on because they don't have a timeline diagnosis like a cancer patient does.
We've returned from Urgent Care, loaded down with the x-rays and tests done there. We could have gone to ER, but most likely we would wait around, they would find nothing and refer us to someone who works Monday through Friday. So, we are back home and hope the PA and Urgent Care can get an appointment tomorrow with an internist OR if things get worse we can go to the ER. trisinger - 74 pounds! It is amazing how the body keeps on keeping on. divvi - Someone on this site suggested having those UTI strips on hand, so I did that a few days ago before calling the doctor. Of course, they did all those tests again and a EKG to compare with a previous one done a few years ago - no change. Whatever, if sleep can cure this I'd say my DH will be well soon.... Thanks for caring.
trisinger, my husband's doctor didn't like the idea of me having the strips either. He showed them to me and explained why it would be better for my husband to just come in if we thought he needed to be tested. He promised me that we could come in even if there were no appointments available because basically the test is handled by one of the nurses. Only if he was positive would he be seen, and then on an emergency basis. If it was negative, he would be tested and sent right back home.
Fran, I am so sorry to hear about your DH! Please keep us posted on his condition. Hopefully you will get in to see the doctor tomorrow and get good news. My prayers are with you and your DH.
Today my DH was awake for the two hours it took us to see the doctor and be scheduled for a CAT scan tomorrow. The rest of the time he is either laying (or is that lying) on the bed sound asleep, or sitting in his chair sound asleep. Seems I am the only one 'sleepless in Bozeman, MT'. I don't know how long it takes to know the results of the scan, but at this point I am not expecting any good news. This is the one time it isn't fun to be roaming around the USA - the only friends I have with me now are those who post on this site! Thank you for being there.
Frand, that is one of the things that has had me concerned about you and your DH is the travel, I know we can't stop the world and get off with this disease but things change so fast it would be hard to travel around with it. I am so sorry for what you are going through and to be away from home makes it more difficult.
Lets just remember that even with Alzheimer, they can also be just like us and have other illness along the way. I will be thinking of you and hope that the results of the test come in ok. I think that is one of the most difficult things, the Alzheimer does not allow us to know when other things are going on, especially with my husband because he can no longer talk.
I didn't realize until I read through this, that all this 'failure to thrive' is mostly about us. I keep remembering the eye contact I had yesterday with the surgeon that might be doing gallbladder surgery - he understands it is a tough call. However, since he doesn't believe the other symptoms are caused by gallbladder disease we still have no other diagnosis. At least we are back on our own turf and now have an appointment with our GP to go over everything done so far and see if he can figure it out. I am rarely sick enough to see a doctor, so all these appointments and then really not knowing anything is hard to take. If no one finds something to treat - then is this failure to thrive?
It is like the Alzheimer's diagnosis. If they can't find any other reason for the dementia, they call it Alzheimer's disease and can't really confirm until after the patient has died. I would think that if they can't find any other reason for your husband's sudden downturn, it probably could be called failure to thrive, or maybe not. This is one of those questions you need a doctor to answer. Or maybe a hospice nurse who has seen it all before.
Starling - I remembered your advice about ER and tonight we went there. Hank has been telling me he can't breathe, so I called the Alzheimer's helpline and gave the symptoms - was told I should take him to ER. So - we signed in and waited an hour with Hank getting more agitated. Then he verbalized, "I'm panicked" and a light went off - with everything else he is having panic attacks! After that hour I went to the desk and found we would be waiting another hour AND all the hospital beds were filled, so we went home.
if you need ER urgently, remember that 'tightening of the chest and inablility to breathe' will get you in asap. they use the priority symptoms which are life threatening always first. even if the waiting roomis full. divvi
frand, a paramedic friend told me that if you want to get seen in the ER in a timely fashion, call an ambulance.....I know that sounds somewhat "over the top", but anyone who has waited for any time at all in a waiting room with someone who has AD knows what I mean.
That was the final straw for me last night - a guy came in with chest pains - and off he went while we sat. Anyway, I suppose this has a more or less happy ending. This morning when Hank got up acting like he does with sundowning I called the ER and found it wasn't busy, got our name on the list and we returned. A pleasant surprise was that the doctor on duty is someone we know. Anyway, now everything is being addressed and it seems like we are getting help. It is possible the panic has given way to ulcers. Whatever, they admitted him to the hospital to see how he reacts to seroquel (or however you spell that). Thankfully he didn't make a liar out of me and started the afternoon agitation. But, 30 minutes after taking that little pill he settled in to sleep. I'm feeling better about things now - and looking forward to a good night's sleep...
Oh, Fran, I'm so relieved for you! Knowing he is finally getting treatment after all this time has to be good news! And now you can catch up on lost sleep! Keep us posted on what the tests show.