My husband turned his license in this summer, He obtained a photo ID that day. I called our insurance agent regarding whether I should take him off the policy, I was told that it didn't make any difference in price to have him on the policy or not, so I just left him on it.
We turned in my husband's license this summer after his neurologist said that he could no longer drive and reported him to the DMV. The insurance company we were with didn't take his name off the policy even though I own our only car and didn't lower the premium because I was already the primary driver on our only car.
Today my insurance agent placed me with the same company I get my home owner's policy and the new one will be in my name only, and it will also be about $200 a year lower in premiums.
We did get an ID card for him, but I did not put it into his wallet. It looks too much like a license. I've got it stashed away.
Oh how I wish I lived in a state that would revoke his license. NYS does not, believe it or not. three doctor's have told Dick that he can't drive. He 'lost' his license and now carries the expired one, I told him I'd send for one for him. I drive all the time because "I need the experience". All of a sudden last night, he decided he is going to drive from now on. He has been LETTING me drive, so he could TEACH me.... so I pointed out that he doesn't have a license. He 's going to DMV first thing in the morning... (of course he doesn't know where it is). Then I told him, you've been DX with AD, 3 doctors have told you you cannot drive, and if you are in an accident, we will be personnally liable. the insurance co will not pay, even if it's not our fault, because you have been told, and I know you are not supposed to drive. Well, the roof caved in when he heard that. And last night was very unpleasant. Don' know what's going to happen next. Just need some solace I guess, and some guidance if anyone has some wise words. HELP Thanks.
ARRRGGH!!! This discussion topic has 6 pages. That says how difficult this topic is. The stress of it all almost landed me in the hospital, and I have written countless blogs about it. I'm STILL dealing with it. The latest blog is still on the home page - it is the Nov. 11/12th one.
No matter who has told him, and the list includes doctors, insurance agents, lawyers, and social workers, my husband does not believe it, nor does he care. Remember, the reasoning button doesn't work. If you skim through some of the posts under this topic, you will see that some people actually give up the driving willingly, but in most cases, it's fight to the death.
I realize I have given you no advice on how to handle this, and for that I apologize. It's just that I have no advice. Except to divert, distract, and go into another room when the ranting starts.
Yes Chris, reverse tactics like in the military. divert his attention or like joan says just leave the room at the first mention of driving, make SURE all keys are in your possession and the car stays locked- one of those wheel locks you can buy for security at pep boys or automotive places would be an extra help during this time as well- i let my DH get into the car then he couldnt figure how to get the wheel lock off so gave up ( ijust watched from a distance but didnt say anything)alot of the time its bluff and they forget if they dont have an audience:)but you cant count on him not getting into the vehicle when you least expect it- this is a very difficult time to go thru. divvi
My husband doesn't comment on the driving issue anymore. However, on the few occasions when his thinking has been worse, I would not trust him to not try and drive. I have hid the extra set of keys so he cannot find them and leave the ones I use hidden in the car under the floor mat. When they are not thinking well, you have to watch them like you would a 3 year old.
Oh, I know, this has been going on seems like forever. Actually, his driving was one of the first things I noticed before he was even diagnosed. He began to be very aggressive on the road, and at one point we were stopped in SC going 97 miles an hour. In fact one of the other drivers pulled behind the cop and told him how irratically he was driving. That was years ago. After that, I wouldn't let him drive to Florida again (we used to drive down every winter), Now we fly, but that really doesn't resolve the problem. Just needed to vent today, because it's particularly. I've read all our blogs and pages on this message board. Just same ole same ole, over and over.
Chris R - - Speed and aggression weren't issues with my DH. I probably would have bailed out if he ever went as fast as 97 mph! My husband didn't stay in the proper lane, cut people short when making turns, and got lost at times.
I live in NYS and DMV does suspend licenses due to certain medical conditions. I brought documentation from his neurologist to DMV this year. DMV said there's a form that physicians can submit directly to them: http://www.nysdmv.com/forms/ds6.pdf. I'm thankful that they didn't make me get the proper form. They sent a letter to my husband directing him to turn in his license soon afterward. My husband was not happy about that and said that he would get another license. He hardly ever mentions it now. I wish I had known 3 years ago that it was that simple to get his license taken away. None of his doctors or any support groups had explained the process to me.
Guess what!!!!!! My husband FOUND a third ignition key for the truck. I left him home while I drove the car 1/2 mile in our rural area to show a rental. Looked up and there he was walking around carrying shrub prunners.
I asked him what he was doing there and he said the phone rang, so I guess he was coming to get me. Called daughter to come and get a vehicle and we came home. I took a Iboprophin and xanax. Hid the third key. He was a little upset with me coming home and said he was not going to continue to take "something" and he might have to move out. Calm as could be since but you can sense "hidden hostility". I bet you can all relate to that at one time or another. Maybe because if I get mad about something I don't "get over it" right away.
Oh dear friends, I noticed this thread began in Sept. of 07! Such a troublesome and anxiety provoker. Mercy.
We went all the way to court as I have said in an earlier post. Right now, DH doesn't drive anything on the ROADS other than his riding lawnmower (to the store for gas and his favorite cherry coke). He drives his truck here on the farm..to the barn and back, etc. He uses it to haul brush and weeds, etc. However, I believe that the day will come when he doesn't 'remember' or RESPECT the fact that he has surrendered his license and I'll be hiding keys. I bought a golf cart for his use when the 'time' comes when he can't actually drive the truck. We're certainly not 'home free' with any of this, but it has been a relief for the past few months that he hasn't driven on the roads.
This was just contributed by pamsc on another thread:
The best story I heard about taking away the keys is someone who filed down the car key on her husband's key chain so it no longer worked (I'm sure a hardware store that made keys would know how to do it). That way he got to keep his keys and she just kept saying something vague about having to get the car fixed.
Many arguments, blistering looks, and crying jags later - I think she's finally given up on driving.
I remember before she was diagnosed I got a phone call from her at our local shopping mall. She said she started the car and couldn't get it to move. I went down to the mall and discovered that she had set the parking brake. At the time she was probably early stage 3, she's now 5+.
I am now firmly convinced that once a diagnosis of dementia is made - the keys have to go. We have to think about the safety of others on the roadway - remember the Golden Rule.
I absolutely agree with Iggy. Whatever you have to do to make it happen, get the keys away. The thought of them causing an accident and someone else gets hurt is one of those things you would never get over. This jogged my memory regarding the 2nd specialist we visited in my efforts to get help for my wife. (This turned out to be yet another Dr. that didn't think there was anything wrong with DW.) Toward the end of the discussion during this appointment I brought up the driving issue and my concerns about an accident. He said "I don't think you have to worry about that. Most people don't think when they drive.......they just drive out of habit"! Thenneck
OMG. With a phone call to our GP, he wrote a letter to the DMV. A couple of weeks later, DH got a letter from the state to come in and have his driving skills tested. After a week of ranting and raving and cursing all the powers that be, he told our son to drive him over to the DMV. Son did that and DH surrendered his license. They gave him a temporary photo ID card. I asked our son if there was any trouble. He said "Surprizingly not! Very smooth." I sold his pickup and deposited the $$ in the bank. He asks about it every once in a while but you have no idea how glad I am that that bridge has been crossed. He was an accident going someplace to happen.
Yesterday he was mad again, becasue he can't drive, and he's no good to anyone, and can't do anything, and doesn't want to spend his life in the 'visitor's' seat (I guess he meant passenger's) So he was mad, until I asked him to help me get the Christmas stuff out of the garage, then I guess he felt useful, and forgot about driving. Hopefully, I also tired him out (grin), so he had to rest after that. let me see, what can i do to keep him kbusy today?
Will he help you do any Christmas baking? How about any cleaning (garage, patio,=) That might work. My DH does not volunteer to do ANYTHING! He sits in his chair. Right now he is reading but I have no idea how much he retains. After I've folded the clothes, he will sometimes take them upstairs to the bedroom. I leave the socks for him to fold. He told me last night he didn't wash them so he shouldn't have to fold them. I said "You're kidding, aren't you?" He sort of smiled and said "I guess." and then he folded them.
But I'm better off than lots of people. He's not yelling at me. He only talks if I ask him a question or talk to him. Kind of sad, isn't it.
My husband has a sleeping disorder like narcolepsy in which he can fall asleep suddenly without warning. He was also driving under the influence of sleeping pills and pain medication. His judgment is so impaired that he does not realize the danger to himself or others. His license has not been revoked, but a call to his doctor would suspend his driving privileges. This is how I handled his whining, complaining, and arguing over driving: 1-I told him I would do whatever was necessary to stop him from driving because I loved him too much to let him kill himself. 2- I told him that if he tried to drive in an impaired condition I would notify the police since driving under the influence of drugs is a felony in our state. 3-I told him I would not argument about his driving. No arguments would change my mind and I refused to argue.When he tried to argue, I kept repeating that I would not discuss it. 4-If I had to choose between having my husband arrested for driving under the influence or killing someone or himself, I knew that I would be willing to have him arrested. I am adamant about protecting my husband and others from danger and protecting myself legally and financially from a lawsuit.
Good for you Lilly, but its time to have his license revoked by you now instead of a prosecuting atty. if hes falling asleep on top of his impaired functioning with AD its double jeopardy. there are legal and monetary implications to having him arrested-it will raise your insurance premiums as well with him having a DUI or worse. he would also most likely be in jail while they sort thru his medical conditions and have him evaluated -then pull his license on top of it anyway. it would be most costly as well for you to get him out of jail, attorney, and then sentencing and fines. i hope you can get this done without all this could imply for his sake as well as yours and the safety of others. Divvi
I bought a new car and my husband couldn't learn how to drive it so he doesn't. We still have a second car and it needs to go to the shop - at least my husband tells me so. I told him that we couldn't afford to bring it to the shop right now because finances are tight. For now he has accepted it and he isn't driving.
Divvi, thanks for your input. Fortunately when I gave my husband a choice between cooperating with me and his doctors or losing his license, he has been acting in a very responsible way. His doctors did not recommend that he stop driving and even I feel safe with his driving when he is cooperative. I watch his driving habits very closely and he knows I will carry out my threats if he becomes a danger to himself or others. In speaking to an eldercare attorney I learned that a lawsuit for killing someone would be much more expensive than any alternative.
My DH is not supposed to drive and he knows it and doesn't complain about it BUT, if a rare occasion arrises when I am gone and IF he can find a set of keys, TWICE he has came looking for me. Only about a half mile, but enough that I have found a new hiding place for the keys. Actually, he can probally drive better than me locally, if he isn't having a confusing day. Driving license and Insurance has not even entered his mind. So take care.....
Lilly ....... I'm sorry and I certainly do not mean to hurt your feelings ...... but ...... I cannot believe you would be so negligent as to allow your husband to drive when you, yourself, admit, and I quote "My husband has a sleeping disorder like narcolepsy in which he can fall asleep suddenly without warning." ........ AND ...... then you compound your statement by stating "He was also driving under the influence of sleeping pills and pain medication. His judgment is so impaired that he does not realize the danger to himself or others."
Lilly ....... give your head a shake ...... you also state ... "I am adamant about protecting my husband and others from danger and protecting myself legally and financially from a lawsuit."
If all of the above statements are true and factual then it is definitely up to YOU to make sure your husband does not drive ....... by the sounds of it, he is an accident just waiting to happen.
Your threats to your husband mean absolutely nothing after he has had an accident and perhaps even taken his own life or the lives of others. I'm sure you don't want to loose everything you and your husband have worked for and end up in the poor house with nothing to your name because, believe me, if your husband has an accident, kills a person or persons you must well know the USA is the most litigious country in the world and you WILL loose everything!
We're all on a dreadful journey here, having to do things we don't really want to do and things which are very hard for us to do but, again, I don't mean to upset you however, you must be the responsible adult here.
Bar-bar- You seem to think that you are more able to judge my husband's driving ability than I can or his many doctors, none of whom think his license should be revoked. His sleep problems were corrected by modifying his medications and obeying his doctor's orders. He is not driving under the influence, nor driving when he is sleepy. I described a problems from the past in the hopes of helping others, not to be judged by you, who are only relying on a few sentences to come to the fallacious conclusion that I am negligent.
Lilly--On the surface, it looks like some judgment was made here. But, in all actuality, I believe it is concern. We all have different ways of expressing ourselves. At first read, I also thought your DH was driving with a sleeping problem as well as an alcohol problem. I did call our PCP and his neuro and they both said MY DH had to stop driving and a letter was written to the state DMV. Two weeks later, he got a letter from the state to come in and have his driving skills re-evaluated. Oh, my gosh. He was so mad. But that's ok. He was going to fight it but then figured he had the state against him, and he surrendered his license. However, he will still tell you that he's probably a better driver than anyone else on the road. I just sold his pickup and that took care of that.
Please don't take offense. I'm sure none was intended. Just concern. We've all been thru this driving issue in one way or another and it works out differently for each individual.
Both of you are missing the point I was trying to make which was that my husband did respond to forceful limit setting. His illness has different symptoms and my approach may not work for others. Although I appreciate you concern, I would prefer if you asked for more information before coming to an erroneous conclusion.
Lilly ....... to know me is to know me ...... I'm a very down to earth and a factual type of person. I do not *frilly* things up with sweet words nor do I skirt around an issue.
Your husband definitely appears, from your own words, to have deficits when it comes to his driving skills. I just want you to remember that if and when something dreadful occurs the onus, responsibility and financial loss will be yours alone to bear ..... your husbands *many* doctors will accept no responsibility whatsoever ..... let me assure you ..... they will simply shake their heads and say 'oh my, how dreadful .... I'm sorry this has happened ....... perhaps we should have told him not to drive'
Believe me ...... I am NO JUDGE of anyone ..... I was simply trying to make you see the vulnerable situation you are placing yourself and your husband in by allowing him, with his deficits and ingestion of his various medications, to continue driving.
I agree with bluedaze, if I had a nickle for everytime my husband promised to try better or not do something...well, lets say I would have extra money in the bank. My husband has FTD, thankfully, he no longer drives, even though I am certain he would see nothing wrong with his driving.
I remember reading an article in Reader’s Digest a number of years ago. They asked men a number of questions. One question was whether or not they considered themselves above average golfers. The answer came out with normal ratios. Another question was regarding their driving abilities. Most considered themselves to be above average in driving skills. I don’t think dementia diminishes this illusion at all.
For women, driving a car is a means of transportation. For men, it impacts their ego in ways I will never understand.
Lori, that's very interesting, and explains a lot. Men and their egos!!! All kinds of ways we'll never understand! Sorry, thenneck and baltob and marsh et al - but it really does seem to be a gender factor!!
Oh dear everyone who is still dealing with this topic. Its such a hard thing. Only yesterday, a friend asked about DH and commented that she hadn't seen him in a while. I replied well, he's not driving now..She said, I'm so THANKFUL, we were so worried and saw him doing some very unsafe things around town. I suspected but NO ONE CALLED ME..to report what they were seeing.
That went on far too long. Our family experienced every emotion mentioned on this thread. The legal, financial, and every other sobering consequence of impaired drivers was constantly lurking while DH was happily going here and there. His truck looked like demolition derby..Fortunately he only collided with OTHERs two times and a bridge one time! With all of that, he never EVER agreed that he was in any way responsible. Something or someone ELSE was to blame. We argued every logical way we could. Threatened every kind of logical threat. It made no difference. As I described somewhere along this thread, it went through the 'process' until he was ordered to appear in court.On that day, he surrendered his license and has thus far respected the law. That said, I know there may come a day when he decides to drive out our gate and go where he pleases. 'There is never a 'comfort level when our loved ones are so physically capable. The very second, I think we've covered our bases on anything, there will be something else.
Regarding the gender driving things, I was driving "mr.daisy' here and there, he was angry and disgusted and it was upsetting that he didn't realize that I was 'trying to help him'.. Then it dawned, he doesn't want to be driven around by his wife (or a woman)..ummmm. Thankfully, our grandson has his license now and proudly drives his Poppy to check the cows and run his errands. What a blessing for this moment in time.
Driving, Driving, Driving.... it's as though you took their masculinity away. I'm not in a copetition when I'm driving. To my husband it was a competitive sport. Even now, with me doing all the driving, I'm either too fast or too slow. He hates for others to pass me, but then says, how fast can they be going. It's a constant struggle, and one that will probably never end, but that's how it is. He cannot drive. Someone said, If you wouldn't let your grandchild in the car with him driving, or your young child, then he shouldn't be driving. Well, my kids wouldn't let him drive their kids long before I stopped his driving. And they were right. But it's such a hard thing to do. Now he thinks he's good for nothing, and honestly, he never did anything much except all the driving, so it really hit him. Nevertheless, i took his license out of his wallet and gave it to my daughter. I was afraid, I might be tempted to give it back to him. We do weaken. But we can't afford to weaken on this subject. I personally am not happy doing all the driving, but that's life in the big city. it's part of the disease that we simply MUST take over, just like paying the bills.
chris, now get your daughter to turn the license into your state's DMV and ask for an ID card instead. In PA, you get the ID card free if you turn in a license. I hid the ID card because it looks too much like a license, but I can say right out to him on the very rare occasions when driving comes up that he does not have a license and he can't drive the car -- not even to move it around in the garage.
In fact his two last accidents, never reported, happened in the driveway.
chris, I had to laugh at your post. My husband has been an angel about giving up driving, and hasn't made any attempt to take the wheel in nearly five years. Still, for him, it always was a competitive sport -- you're so very right about that!!! -- and even now, he will make comments about what he would have done differently if someone cuts me off or is otherwise rude. If someone pulls in front of me to be first in line at the stoplight, for example, he says he would honk the very instant the light changed.
I just laugh at him and tell him it's a miracle he's lived to such a ripe old age, or point out that it's better not to let them know they've succeeded in irritating me.
After a very minor accident 3 years ago in front of our house, my DH handed me his keys and said his reflexes were not good enough to drive! We had already sold his red pickup truck, so we only had the one SUV. It's never been a problem since. I always loved to drive and did most of it on trips particularly, so he was used to that. He will, however, tell me we are coming to a red light, or someone is passing me on the right, etc. I do acknowledge that, with a "thanks" though. He was never good at maintenance on the car even before ALZ. I have always done that - love cars, love racing and would love to have my 1965 red convertible Mustang back!
I had to have our van removed from the property before DH was released from the hospital after Dx. They told him he couldn't drive then, but when he was bvetter he could be tested to see about renewing his license. He locked on that and year later was pushing HARD to be tested. His Doctor would tell me he'd never drive again, or he'll never pass the testing,; but then turned around and agreed to order the testing for DH. One part of the test is a medical evaluation provided by the Dr. That is what failed the test--he never even got to the other 2 parts. Some of you hahve been luck to have a Dr. send information to the DMV. Our experience was that the Dr. would not face DH and tell him---"Because you have VaD, there is too much nerve damage for you to be a safe driver." We had to go through the process so the information came from somewhere else. In the meantime relatives were backing up his need to be able to dive, come and go, etc. We're past that now. Thank goodness.
Lilly, has your husband officially been diagnosed with Alzheimer's? If so, in some states it is the law that the doctor report it to the driving license bureau and the driver's license is replaced with an ID card. I know that taking driving away from your spouse is the roughest argument there is with your spouse, and some become violent. Plus, we like them to continue to run to the store for us, and let's face it - driving a car is freedom. Joan's been dealing with this for months with her husband.
However, you must do what you feel is best in your situation. No one here judges you. We WILL give you advice whether you want it or not! <grin> That is what friends do.
I just request that you ask yourself this question: If your husband accidentally ran over a child and killed it, would you blame yourself for that death, and are you prepared for the lawsuit that child's parents will file against you?
I lasted a month after being asked that question before I asked his doctor to tell my husband that he couldn't drive any more. I hold all of the car keys in my purse (he doesn't know that) and I still (after a year and a half) occasionally have to remind him that he can't drive any more. It's one of the hardest things you will ever do.
Okay, so driving is hard for men to give up because it's maybe some sort of an ego thing for them -- is there something comparable that the "gentler sex" just can't stand to give up? My DW was an excellent driver, but she gave up driving with no hesitation at all after one minor fender bender and a few instances of getting lost. She's also cheerfully given up cooking, shopping, etc . -- things that one might theorize that she could have felt "possessive" about. The only thing that she still seems to really want to hang onto is pulling up her own panties after we go potty -- I could do it lots better without her help, but she just can't seem to keep her hands off!
Driving was a big issue. By working together our daughter and I took away any and every reason my wife had to drive. We made sure she got to every doctor's appointment and took her anywhere and everywhere she wanted or needed to go. By using this approach we finally weaned her off of her dependency on her car. We created a new habit, now she automatically depends on someone else to drive her. She doesn't mention driving the car anymore.
I sold her car this past spring, I told her that if she wanted me to retire next year we would need to sell the other car because the payment was too much. We now have one car, I drive it to work, the spare key has never been programmed to work in the new car, it will fit in the ignition, turn, unlock the door and the trunk, it just wont start the car.
She told me around Thanksgiving that I needed to buy her a new little car so she could do the grocery shopping and run errands. Our oldest son was visiting at the time, he quite emphatically told her "mom, you have no business driving a car, you don't need a car"! It worked, she hasn't mentioned it since. She now says she won't renew her driver's license when it expires.
While I appreciate the logic of the turn in license and get a state issued photo ID, the process would be just another stressor. I'm not sure what changing from one little plastic thing to another little plastic thing accomplishes. Going to the DMV, waiting in lines of generally unruly, hostile strangers is no walk in the park. There is no danger of my DW ever driving again, despite her license not expring until 2012. I took her off the car insurance policy and insurance company flagged it as another driver at this address. I called them, explained the situation and told them to put a specifc exclusion if they wanted.
Thankfully, when I took my husband to turn in his license, it was an easy process. I explained he wouldn't be able to sign his name & the reason why, they were very nice & let me do everything for him. I even directed him to where the photo was to be taken. In my state if you turn in your license, it doesn't cost anything for the Photo ID.
Dking, (or anyone else needing a state ID) i found our DMV very helpful and they moved my DH thru immediately with no wait, due to the AD . i took him in and told them the situation and we have his paperwork, foto done within 20min..some people DO get it! :) divvi ps you can call ahead as well and they may give you a person to see asap you get there!
I don't understand the license/id situation either. My husband still has his license, but he doesn't carry his wallet, he only goes outside with me or one of the kids, so he doesn't need it for ID because I have both of ours and the kids have theirs. I carry his med list, Insurance Card in my purse. I talked to our Insurance Agent and they see no need to take him off the policy because they know he doesn't drive. Perhaps your loved ones are more mobile than we are here.
We turned in my husband's license at the AAA. In PA there are a whole bunch of places to use to turn it in, and that was the one we chose. No lines. No stress.
As for WHY it was to point out that he could not drive because he DID NOT HAVE A LICENSE. And that was that! It was necessary in my husband's case to reinforce what the doctor had said and what the scary policeman had said. And it worked.
Imohr, I keep the keys hid too. <grin> Which is the most important thing to do once you are in, or past, transition past driving. Removing him from the policy was a different issue. I also changed insurance companies, and once I had done that my premium went way down. I wanted the policy in my own name.
Just make sure you have a current passport or drivers license or id card. My mother (not AD) who no longer drives, tried to cash in a CD at the bank and her state id card had expired. She had to get a current one before the bank would allow any changes. PatB
yes the State ID would be for banks/airports etc only would come into play once their drivers lic is up for renewal or expiring and you cant/wont renew it. so we chose to get the pic ID for identification and banking issues etc. many times an older spouse like mine was on our insurance and the policy was 'rated' on him as a senior driver- when i took him off, like Starling my insur dropped too because i am younger and a clean driving record.:) just a thought -divvi