You know that I like to keep particular topics under one discussion, but I wanted to focus specifically on today's blog, and the Driving Issue Topic got so big, I didn't want the responses to this blog to get buried, so I started a new driving topic. I invite you to read today's blog, which brings up a very important issue about AD and driving, which has my husband in an uproar, and this time I agree with him.
NOTE: You may have to "refresh" your browser for today's blog to come up with this correct topic listed for message board posting.
APOLOGY TO GUY: In moving your post from the other driving topic to this one, I accidentally deleted it. :( So sorry. If you read this, please post it again here.
Comment Author Starling Comment Time 40 minutes ago edit delete
Some of the driving that is going on is the result of denial on the part of the children of the patient.
I know that a neighbor who's Mother-in-law has much worse dementia than my husband has was driving up until this time last year, when they brought her here so she could spend the Winter closer to them. Her neighbors were planning on hiding her car because she scared them silly, but her son didn't think anything was wrong with her, and has only now begun to admit that she is sick. She is now living in a locked dementia ward in one of the local nursing homes because the nursing home decided that was where she needed to be.
When they closed up her house they threw away clothes that still had the tags on them that were so old that they were falling apart, and a huge amount of outdated food.
Joan, Thought something happened. :>) I'll try to remember what I wrote...
Driving:
My wife woke me up this morning about 6am to tell me she was angry about something. Her brother just had a fender-bender and she said, "Why can he drive and I can't, I don't ever get into accidents." (She has had a few fender-benders of the years and got hit by a truck before I met her back in the late 80's.) She was however a very good and safe driver for most of the time I have known her.
I tried to explain rationally. (I'm finding that this doesn't work as well as it once did.) The doctor told us back in May that she should not drive. She is very upset about this as she has ALWAYS been SO independent. Since going on disability back in 2002 due to Post-Polio Syndrome, she was always helping friends and family and driving them everywhere. She was always running an errand! Now she feels like there is no "real" reason for her to stop driving. She was quite upset and nothing I said was helping. I told her that she wouldn't care if she got hurt, but that she could never live with herself if she hurt someone else, especially a child. I hugged and said that I will drive her anywhere she wants to go day or night. I have always done the driving when we were together. Especially on vacations. I LOVE to drive.
I gave her a kiss and went into the kitchen to make breakfast despite the fog I was still in after she woke me up.
The thing is, it isn't just about the driving and there will never be a good answer to this. It is about the loss of freedom and dignity. There is no good answer to this.
Guy said it very well, it is really about the loss of freedom and independence. It is also about denial, the difficulties inherent with trying to make a spouse or parent stop driving for their safety and those on the road. Add to that a person who is no longer in complete control of their mental processes and it is an even bigger problem.
How many "normal" people are there that drive when they are somewhat impaired due to drinking, medication, emotional upsets, exhaustion, etc.
This is one of those very thorny issues. I am very much in favor of having a person with dementia who is still driving be tested on a regular basis to see if they should continue to drive. I actually think that it would be good for all liscenced drivers to be tested on a regular basis to see if they should still be driving. There are many reasons why a person should not be driving, somehwere along the way we stopped looking at driving as a privilege and look at it more as a "right". Our lifestyles assume that we will be driving, it is part of our culture.
I have to tell you that given up driving is so hard for everyone not just those with AD. I work for a blind foundation and I read some notes from donors that say I cannot see but I only drive to the store and my doctors appt's which is less than a mile from home. I go slow and am careful. Well statistics prove that most accidents happen within 25 miles from home. How many are those who cannot see or cannot think quickly enough to avoid an accident. My DH was a truck driver for over 50 years and that was a great distress to him when I told him it was not safe and he could not drive any more. I overheard him say to a couple of motorcycle people waiting for gas at the station near home that it didn't matter that my wife would not get registration or insurance on my motorcycle because I am going to drive it anyway. It is no longer is an issue since he is a NH but we did have to disable his vehicles.
I have a great deal of sympathy for the AD driver who has to turn in their keys and stop driving however, I also know through the experience of caregiving my husband for several years that even though he had not had an accident while driving, his cognitive skills were irractic and not to be relied upon. It only takes one instance of loss in memory or being able to react appropriately to driving condiitons and situations for an acccident to occur. I knew that if he had an accident and killed or hurt someone that I would never be able to forgive m;yself. Thankfully when my husband was told that I would do the driving from then on, he acquiesced without fighting the inevitable. I know this can entail a hardship on the family but I think we must be responsible for others we encounter driving. Tthis is not done I know with other drivers who do not have AD but whom drive while drinking, who cannot react to a possible encounter with dexterity (possible physical handicaps), and I think that older people need to take driving refresher courses after a certain age too. These people howeveer still are expected to be able to think correctly cognitively but we can not realistically expect an AD person to do so always.
I think there should be some kind or test to renew your license after a certain age. I have a friend in WV who turned 90 and he got a letter from the DMV to come in for some kind of driving test to renew. He is a fit and mentally ok for his age so he passed.
My SIL told me his Uncle was driving, became lost and died in a secluded area. His wife had not told anyone, even family, of memory problems.
I have a acquaintenance whose H is still driving and her sister says she has to ride with him and tell him where to turn, etc.
My uncle was still driving at 92. He had old age dementia, his FD told his daughter to leave him be and let him drive.(he lived in a rural area) I don't understand this at all. He became missing one day and the second day he pulled into a service station 70 miles from home and they called his family to come get him. He had ran into a tree somewhere but did not disable the vehicle.
This is just 3 close to home incidences I am aware of, so you know there are thousands more. Where are the families????? What are they thinking?????
I agree with therrja that it would be good if all licensed drivers had to be periodically re-tested. In Ontario anyone over 80 with a driver's licence has to take a written test every 2 years but not a road test. How stupid is that! Depth perception changes as we age as does night vision and many of us are on meds which could affect our driving ability. Our licences are good for five years now and a lot can happen during that time. Anyone who allows a person with dementia to drive is failing in their duty to their fellow citizens.
When my husband was first diagnosed, the doctor told us that California at one time automatically yanked driver's liscenses when a person was diagnosed with AD. I don't think that is right either. In the early stages, it may be okay for the person to continue to drive.
The "allow" part is even more difficult. When I think of the difficulties I had with my DH when trying to get him to not drive nights anymore and then gradually curtailed all his driving, it wasn't that easy. There were a couple of times, he got angry and just took off in the car.
This is one of the places where being a caregiver is being caught between the rock and a hard place.
In Illinois all persons age 75 and over must take a driving exam. All drivers must take a written exam every eight years, except those having no traffic convictions. If you have an accident on your driving record you may be required to take the written and/or driving exams. My grandmother who is 95 and has no mental problems just this year gave up her license voluntarily after a bad bout of pneumonia. She had to take a road test every year and she always passed.
Joan I feel compassion for Sid and believe he is right to question why others with dementia are still driving. but remember, YOU did the right thing, and cant account for what other families or individuals do or dont do for their loved ones safety. each of us has the duty make sure our loved ones are not the ones on the roads getting lost or causing accidents or loss of life. there is no rationalizing that a person is 'safe' to drive once dementia has been diagnosed- and for my own comfort, i believe that once that dx is rendered yes they need to give up driving, period. as we k now most of the time they are already into yrs of AD before they get a definate AD dx. the complex issues of executive thinking play vital roles in making driving decisions and we know these definately affected with AD upfront and usually show up in the cognitive testing. from a legal standpoint, the risks outweigh the dramas of losing the priveleges and loss of independence. luckily i have not heard on this site of one of our members being sued over their AD spouses involvement in an accident. thank goodness. there is no leg to stand on for defense no matter WHAT stage they are in if the AD was dx prior to an accident. most people who are with AD and have a still valid DL have done it thru the mail or got it renewed very early in Dx and not said anything to any authorities about the disease-thats why they are still driving. each state has a medical advisory board to review a persons file who has any disability that could hinder their driving abilites. but thats only IF the person says they have one. if they get caught lying and it comes to light there would be severe repercussions legally and possible indictments of misrepresentation on renewals of DL. the list goes on and on WHY they should not be driving... divvi
New York renews licences for 10 yrs.... 10 yrs. can you imagine, no eye test even, never mind a road test. My DH was 83 the last time we had our licences renewed, and I couldn't believe it. I was 63, and I don't think they should have given me a 10 yr licence. Are they crazy... Do you know what can happen in one year, nevermind 10. It's to save paperwork, Well, Excuuuuuse me. Paper is cheaper than lives. Joan, I took my husbands licence. I hid it, and told him he lost it, and that I would send for a duplicate, but it takes 6 weeks. And I tell him that every week. It hasn't arrived yet, it takes 6 weeks. Why are these people driving, well first, they are in denial, and second.... They are not the Passenger. After being the passenger for awhile, you become acutely aware that if you don't take an action of some sort, you will be killed because you are in the car with a maniac. My DH is also a much better driver than I probably will ever be... but, his judgement, his temper, his emotions, his memory all interfere with how well he used to drive. He was always a little volatile, but with the AD, he became the policeman of the road... chasing other cars and honking at them to make them put thier lites on in broad daylight. No I had to take an action, but it was my life that was on the line.
For those that struggle with taking driving privilages away, consider talking with your local drivers licensing bureau and explain to them your concern for the safety of others on the road when your spouse is still driving. Explain to your spouse you will only agree to let them drive if they can pass the driving test. Bring in your spouse for the test & if the officer sees first hand how poorly your spouse drives, he/she will have no qualms about pulling their license. Then they are the bad guy and it is possible that since it was an authority that made the decision is will be more accepted. Unfortunately, this doesn't solve the loss of independance that driving provides, but I think safety should come first.
Also, more and more today you need a photo I.D.for things. Without a drivers license, that gets to be a headache. I can't speak for all states but here in MT you can get a photo I.D. issued by the drivers license bureau. It looks almost like a drivers license but clearly states it is just a personal identification card. $8 for this. I got 3 copies. I keep one in my wallet, my son keeps one and I have 1 extra in case someone else takes my wife somewhere. It says in a kit I have with her pills, instructions, walkie talkies, etc etc. Thenneck
At this point I believe all states give ID cards for non-drivers. Because photo IDs are required for so many things including travelling there needs to be a simple way to get a good one, and the state ID card is now required for a lot of the same things Licences are required for.